What do women want?

Abbey O'Reilly at The F Word wrote Do you love a bad boy? in response to an article (to which she links) in the Daily Mail about why women love so-called bad boys. She begins with a hypothetical situation: you walk into a bar. At one end, sitting alone doing a crossword puzzle (so he appears interesting and smart, rather than a boring loner), who seems polite but isn't exactly going to spark up any conversations in order to prove that one way or the other. At the other end of the bar is your typical James Bond type, with his arm around one girl and his eyes around another, but as soon as any other female comes near him it is his prerogative to rape her with his eyes. He's a schmuck, but completely surrounded by women because they feel special around him, flattered, and don't mind that he's going to try to "fuck and chuck" each and every one of them, all in the same night if he can.

After giving this hypothetical, O'Reilly asks, "If you had to, which one would you choose?"

Uh. Neither. Professors of psychology, experts in all fields, any given heterosexual man, and just about everyone on earth likes to hypothesize about what (heterosexual) women want -- because lesbians are no mystery: lesbians want other lesbians, mystery solved; but straight girls are to be analyzed and tested to see to which stereotype of the heterosexual man they react to the strongest. Nevermind that the author of the study cited in the Daily Mail article did this by asking 200 male college students how many women they had slept with. (Because obviously the best way to assess what kind of straight guy women like is to ask the straight guys. I guarantee you almost every single one of those guys said "women love me, just look how many I've fucked". That is air-tight logic right there.)

Let me tell you "what women want". Speaking as a woman who is more human than stereotype: I like a man who is more human than stereotype. Sure, the guy at the asshole end of the Straight Guy Archetype Spectrum may be pretty, but he's an asshole, and I guarantee you that assholes are resistible. Meanwhile, the guy at the emo-loner end of the Straight Guy Archetype Spectrum (hereafter to be known as the SGAS), is equally as resistible, because all told: he's an asshole too.

The emo-loner archetype is constantly underestimated for his asshattery, because women fail to understand that this guy sees you as an object too: the fulfiller of his every childish need until you become the breaker of his poor widdle hearwt. If he writes a song about you, it'll be more about him. He is just as self-centered as the guy who will try to take your clothes off the minute the two of you are alone: that's why he's sitting ALONE in a bar doing a fucking crossword puzzle. He doesn't have a friends because the degree of his self-centeredness is fucking annoying and no one wants to be around him.

The kind of guy who always wins the dating game is the kind who doesn't fit comfortably into any one archetype because he's mature enough to understand that there are many aspects of the self, and neither he, nor you, is an archetype or stereotype, but a person. What a concept! That's the kind of man women want! The funny thing is that any guy who fits an archetype from Prince Charming (riding to save the day and protect you from everything, because you're a precious object not a person), to James Bond (you're fucking gorgeous, wants to shag you all night and then never call you because you're a trophy not a person), to Emo-Loner (loves you so much, you're his everything, not a person; will write sad poetry about how you broke his heart and trampled all over him because now you're an evil bitch, not a person, but that poetry can get him laid cause it makes him seem "sensitive"), to Mr. Big (rich and independent, terrified of commitment, but knows that you can save him because you're a savior not a person), to any other archetype you might be able to think of; any of these archetypal guys can fake their way into the kind of guy who is more human than stereotype, but after a while it's really easy to see through his bullshit. (These things can go for all people, all genders, and all sexual orientations -- we're all disaffected to some degree and all have different ways of coping. People aren't stereotypes though, they're people. It's just that some of them are a lot more comfortable in their stereotypes.)

The point of all of this is two fold. First of all, if you want to know what a woman wants in a man: fucking ask her! Don't go ask all the guys she's slept with what kind of guy they are and then assume that if you act like those guys she'll want to be with you. There's a reason people break up. There's a reason for one-night-stands. People are as flawed as they are diverse, and just because I have a history of dating assholes doesn't mean I want my current boyfriend to become one!

Secondly, the kind of person a genuine person wants to be with is another genuine person. We don't force ourselves into societal archetypes because we're not comfortable with them, and so the kind of person who does force him or herself into an archetype is not the kind of person we want to be with. Maybe the James Bond guy does get a lot of ass, but I am willing to bet that the kinds of guys who exhibit this type of behavior have never had a truly emotionally fulfilling relationship. I'm also willing to put money on the guy who worships his girlfriend so hard she eventually feels like he's stalking her, never having had an emotionally fulfilling relationship either -- that's why all his songs are about pain and agony and how he cuts himself he's so destroyed over the elusive her.

So, back to the bar analogy. There's a third guy in the bar. He's talking and laughing with his friends, and doesn't appear to be there with anyone. He sees you at the same time the guy mobbed by Barbie dolls is trying to master telekinesis in order to take your clothes off, and crossword puzzle guy tries to look really interested in his puzzle while secretly hoping you'll be the next person to break his heart. Assuming you came to this bar to meet someone new, possible to get a date or get laid, which of these three guys are you going to talk to, offer to buy a drink for, or accept a drink from?

I know my answer. I know that if I wasn't already nailing the third guy, I would totally want to.

Affectionately,
Rachel

Posted by Rachel_Setzer - July 15, 2008, at 12:39PM | in Sex
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8 Comments

I'm grossly offended by your stereotyping of stereotypes! I suppose that all stereotypical guys are just non-human objects for you to hang your stereotyping on rather than real people, huh?

In all seriousness, the reason that they're called stereotypes is because they encompass vague prejudices that can be used to size people up on sight. I don't know if you actually know any of the sort of highly-stereotypical men you described, or if such men even truly exist. Most of us are rather more complicated and multi-faceted than your simple stereotypes. Anyone who wins in the dating game, or in social relationships in general, usually does best to avoid stereotyping everyone they meet.

Great post! And so totally true...I like real people, flawed and human and wonderful people. Cardboard cutouts and people playing a role leave me cold. I'm going to copy this and email it to all my guy friends who are convinced that they will not find a girl unless they buff up and act like pricks, because that's what they see in movies, advertising etc.

It makes me sad b/c it seems like we all spend way too much time and energy driving the genders apart with this sort of silliness like "what type does ________ want?" as if there was a formula or a standard? If you look at the guys I've dated (and please tell me if this is true or not for you), there would appear to be very few common factors...they all looked pretty different, they all had different personalities, but they all were interesting to me for reasons other than the surface observations or adherence to a stereotype.

Teh guyz tell me this is true on their end too. They may watch porn and stare at the girls in music videos, but really, they are attracted to a variety of shapes/sizes/personalities in real women and prefer real down-to-earth women over Barbie stereotypes or clinging vines.

I guess it all comes down to "evaluate each person you meet as an individual and try to leave out any stereotyping or judgements until you get to know the person"....seems like it might help out with sexism/racism/classism, but then what they hell do I know?

I'm really glad that you wrote this! I am so sick of people saying "girls want bad boys," and in particular of people suggesting that I, specifically, want a "bad boy."

While I agree with the bulk of your post, I have to say that to act like the common perception of lesbians goes anything like this in relation to heterosexual women: "...because lesbians are no mystery: lesbians want other lesbians, mystery solved; but straight girls are to be analyzed and tested to see to which stereotype of the heterosexual man they react to the strongest" is beyond ludicrous. If that were the case there'd be a whole lot less stereotyping about what lesbian couples are "supposed" to look like, and a lot less criticism about the gender presentations present within lesbian relationships. If it was that simple, people wouldn't gawk at my fiancee and I for daring to be a "femme/femme" couple in a world where even many of the most "gay friendly" people think one of us is supposed to be "butch." While obviously same sex relationships are overall more taboo to discuss, that is the reason why they are not analyzed by their reactions to tired old stereotypes; because of prejudice, not because we're supposed to be easier to figure out.

I'm sorry Llesbian Llama! I didn't mean to imply that hetero women think that way, I had hoped that that line was sufficiently satirical. Obviously I don't think that way about lesbians any more than I think that gay men are as simple as "gay men want to have sex with men", or hetero guys want just to have sex with women, or hetero women just want to have sex with guys.

What I meant is that this constant evaluation of what women want completely ignores lesbians because they people doing the research aren't really interested in what women want unless those women want them, and since most of these researchers are men, lesbians are ignored for the purpose of determining what women want with no qualifications on behalf of the researchers saying that they want to know what straight women want in men. And so the line that you quoted is my perceived attitude of those conducting this "research" into what women want by asking men what they're like and how many women they've fucked.

I understand what you're saying now. I think a bit of the sarcasm may have been lost in translation, but isn't that so often the case with the written word?

Don't worry about it. I thought your post was very good overall! I didn't mean to be overly nitpicky or critical. :)

Not at all! I don't think there is any harm in my clarifying my words.

This post originally came from my Myspace blog, and all the people who read that know my writing and speaking style pretty well. Here... it's another story, not everyone is as familiar with my off-the-cuff humor, sarcasm, and irony.

Just remember: gender is a hive mind! What one XX wants, all XXs want! There is no room for exceptions!

And oh, the phenomenon of Nice Guys. They are my least favorite people ever. "I deserve sex! I'm nice to you!" And here I thought people were nice because they liked each other. Turns out, it's because they want head. My mistake.

In short, I agree with you totally.

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