Will men still want us?

I'm taking a class about women, men and the media.  Right now we're talking about images of women in the media and how it affects women and their attitudes about beauty and such.  So much of the articles talk about the effect on the minds of women when they view the images portrayed in the media.   But, I think that all these articles forget about a really important aspect of all of this.  What about the effects on the minds of men when they see these images?  I'm sick of hearing all this talk about how women are letting these unreal ideals of beauty make them feel less worthy.  I want to hear SOMETHING  about the responsibility that men bear in this as well.  Because, as women, we look at the majority of those women and KNOW  that we can never look like that, and most of us are probably pretty okay with that.  After all, we've had our entire life to come to terms with the fact that we're not 5'9'' or a D cup or whatever it is. 

But, men don't live looking in the mirror everyday at the reality that is a woman's body.  They live looking at the media portrayals.  They live, I believe, much more than women under the mindset that this is what a sexy woman looks like, that this is what they want, that if they only make enough money, or get the right car, or talk the right game that they can land that perfect 10 and accomplishing anything less would be settling.  They see those women and think, why can't my girlfriend have legs like that?  Men don't live their lives worrying about cellulite, trying everything to get rid of it and knowing that in reality nothing will work as well as they want it to.  Men don't live their lives in the minds of women.  So men don't understand that what they see isn't reality.  And quite frankly, I don't think anyone could change that but men, themselves.  After all, if a woman told a man that women didn't really look like that, she becomes a jealous women who just feels bad about herself, right?  But, when's the last time you hear a strong, influential man address this issue to other men?   I would wager a guess and so NEVER. 

This is why I'm so frustrated that no one seems to talk about this.  Do we, as women, really think that the media are the ones pressuring us to look like that? No.  We think that MEN are the ones pressuring us to look like that, because if we don't, they will think something's wrong.  They have so many other women that could look at, on tv, on the internet...how are they to be satisfied with our reality of imperfection?   THAT's what we're scared of.  That's the truth behind all of it.  Whether or not the majority of men truly do think this way,  I don't know.  I'm not a man, obviously.  But, I can tell you that from all the conversations I've heard from my guy friends, and all of my personal experience, this is the overwhelming sense that we, as women, get from men.  The truth is that we feel like if we look anything less than Jessica Alba, it's not that we'll be innately unhappy with ourselves, but that we're scared men will be, and therefore we become unhappy about ourselves.  All I'm saying is that the way media portray women has consequences that are so deep and long reaching that I have no idea how to begin to change it.  Does it begin with women? Does it begin with men? Does it begin with women and men working together?  I don't know.  All I'm saying is that we need to look at not only how media affects women's idea of beauty, but also men's.  Because ultimately, whether this is something that needs to be changed or not, women still (and will probably ALWAYS) feel the desire to be beautiful and attractive and to have men find them beautiful and attractive.  And we all have to face the reailty that the main thing the media has done has simply been to make the "ideal" body type a thousand times more accessible to men than it ever has been in the past, therefore, making women feel the pressure to look like this about a thousand times more than we ever have in the past.

Posted by vintgeglamourgrl - September 28, 2008, at 05:54AM | in Media
0

0 TrackBacks

Listed below are links to blogs that reference this entry: Will men still want us?.

TrackBack URL for this entry: http://www.feministing.com/cgi-bin/movabletype/mt-tb.fcgi/9526

12 Comments

[0+|0-] Author Profile Page s. pisaster said:

I actually have had a completely different experience with the men in my life - most of them are very aware that the media portrayals of women are a fantasy, and their idea of what makes a woman beautiful is much broader than the magazines would have us believe. I've had a lot of frank discussion about this with both male friends and partners and almost never come across a guy who I respected who felt that any woman who wasn't physically perfect was unacceptable. I do agree though that the culture makes us feel that men will think we're inadequate if we don't look like the media-dictated ideal, and there are some men who accept and aim for that ideal but....frankly, those men are easily influenced and insecure and I wouldn't want one of them anyway. I'd rather date and be friends with men who can think for themselves.

[0+|0-] Author Profile Page Dominique said:

It takes a very mature and accepting man to see past the beauty myth. Sure, the good guys, the ones we can respect, will do so. But they don't grow on trees... And undoubtedly, they are made, not born.

I agree that men's perceptions have a lot to do with how we feel and react. In fact, here are results from a dating survey asking men and women what they thought was important:

First Attraction

Men Like:
- 32% Physical Appearance/Body
- 24% Beautiful Face/Eyes
- 16% Sense of Humor

Women Like:
- 32% Sense of Humor
- 19% Physical Appearance/Body
- 14% Caring/Sensitivity

And here's a comment from an blogger about her online dating experiences:

"In the 50+ category, I accept that men will have bald spots, bald heads, white hair, bellies, imperfect teeth, and wrinkles. And no, those things don't make them look more distinguished and handsome.
But it seems that all these less-than-perfect guys are looking for slender, fit women, preferably with big boobs. Models, in other words, that are blind to their imperfections and flaws."
(http://www.successfulonlinedating.com/2008/03/10/mens-search-for-physical-perfection/)

[0+|0-] Author Profile Page B said:

This is just my personal experience, but none of the guys I know buy into that stuff. Their definition of what makes a woman attractive is much broader and more realistic than the media's.

I did know a lot of boys in high school who would act like complete assholes and bash on girls for not looking like the swimsuit models that accompanied all the sports cars in their lame auto magazines (haha), but now that I'm in my 20s it seems like I put waaaaaaay more pressure on myself to conform to the supermodel ideal than my boyfriend or any other male does.

I'm not defending all men and I'm certainly not defending or trivializing the media ideal, but it's like what my exasperated friend said after his girlfriend complained about her ass getting fat: "Women need to stop looking at all these magazines and shit and thinking that they need to look like that. Ignore it. Men have always liked your body the way it is since the beginning of time regardless of what the goddamn media says. They're two completely different things."

[0+|0-] Author Profile Page VintgeGlamourGrl said:

You all may be right, that many grown men are able to distinguish between the images they see and reality. Although, I do think the message that we as women overwhelmingly receive is that to the contrary. Whether that's from men, other women, the media, I'm not entirely sure. But the biggest issue for me in this is in the younger generation. The 12 year old girls that I see walking around in clothes that even I wouldn't wear now that I'm 21. It scares me to think that 10, 11, 12 year boys are looking at the images of women in the media, especially video games, and thinking that's what a woman should look like. And it scares me to think what happens to young girls when they see the boy they have a crush on looking at this type of portrayal. I don't think that many boys that age have the true capacity to distinguish between the reality of what women look like and the image of women that is constantly bombarding them. If they don't have a strong parental presence in their life setting them straight (as I'm afraid many don't), I can only imagine how skewed their perception of reality is. And I can only imagine how much that skewed perception is influencing the girls that want to impress these boys.

I'm just going to chime in my personal experience/frustration... Many men I've known in my life supposedly are capable of distinguishing the difference between the ideal model and how most women appear. Their "ideal" woman may be more realistic, but they still glorify the models. I have never met a man who has preferred the look of an average woman over that of a model's. Never. Regardless of what they say, they still find the surgically altered body of a celebrity or model more desirable, but they settle for what is real because women with the "average" or "real" body probably has a more desirable personality and lifestyle than that of a model. And overall, at least a good portion of men do value personality over appearance.

However, men are ingrained from childhood to value a woman's appearance so much that they can't seem to mentally straighten out their priorities in what to look for in a partner. What seems to happen is that men grow so entitled to our bodies that every time they find a woman attractive, or another woman "more attractive" than the one he is currently with, he feels entitled to her. So he cheats or leaves. But he continues to do this over and over, regardless of how "ideal" the woman he cheats with, on, or leaves resembles that which the media promotes.

It's endless and sick. Men may be able to distinguish reality from fantasy, but they sure as hell can't prioritize what they want more- a person or a thing. I can imagine that it's hard for men to come to terms with this and that this makes it exceedingly hard and nearly impossible to form the real, loving bonds with women that they crave.. but I don't feel sorry for them because they brought it upon themselves and continue to pass these destructive behaviors from father to child, brother to brother, friend to friend.

So yes, I blame men for this. I blame every single man who hates that this is how society lives and yet still finds it more worthy to wank off to porn or fantasize over Carmen Electra while having sex with his partner because these women are "hotter". I blame every man who tells his partner or female friend that she should be comfortable with how she looks, yet would ultimately prefer to turn his head to gaze longingly at a model. And I blame every man who whines that this is the standard attitude expected of his gender, yet he does nothing to stop it or change it.

[0+|0-] Author Profile Page gopher said:

I can remember when I was in the 7th grade all my friends and family thought that I was anorexic. To a certain degree, they were right. I was 5'3 and pushing 100 pounds. I exercised for three hours, sometimes both in the mornings and at night. I also counted calories religiously, sometimes not straying from 500 cals a day. My experience wasnt at all as dramatic and serious as many others. I saw looks as an outlet for ambition and power. Because I saw my looks as a reflection of my power and drive I would have breakdowns when I wasnt looking 'perfect' and when I wouldnt exercise it was like I would fall into this very deep negativety about myself. Eventually I broke free from this crap, but perhaps it sheds light on the fact that many women are indoctrinated to see their physical looks as a reflection of their power, competency and capability. Boys are taught to see their abilities in what they do, but girls are taught to see "power" in how they look. Its very deceiving and ends up causing alot of problems.

@gopher: "Eventually I broke free from this crap, but perhaps it sheds light on the fact that many women are indoctrinated to see their physical looks as a reflection of their power, competency and capability."

I got a better idea about this when I started traveling. See in my home country, I'm apparently not much to look at.

But when I travel, a lot of people see me as "exotic". They don't know where I'm from. Men stare, strangers approach and say that I have a pretty face, or that I look like some always unnamed actress (yeah, right dudes).

I go back to visit my home country, and I'm invisible again. Just like that. I probably couldn't even get the time from a stranger if I wanted it, lol.

I'm an adult, so I can sit back and laugh this shit off. But what a head fuck for a teenager, growing into an adult body.

Or how about being ignored, while other around you bask in their new found "power". Or how about negative attention (inappropriate gestures from old men or teachers), which was my case growing up.

This is why this power that women supposedly have over men is bullshit. True power isn't at the whim of the latest fashion and cultural beauty standards. True power doesn't fade just because you are a decade older yet still in the prime of your life.

As far as the media, it acts mainly as reinforcement. And it is allowed to be so efficient because of our mixed puritan/hypersexualized culture.

So yeah, I do think men have a role in this, but in different way that the author expressed.

I do think that a lot of the commenters are right in saying that mature, realistic men make a distinction between the media image and reality.

But the deeper point is that when you're inundated with images it makes it really hard to get any critical distance and make these kinds of distinctions. And often I think you say what you know you're supposed to say, but your deeper beliefs and preferences are profoundly influenced by the images and implicit messages that surround you. So either way, it is very damaging to both men and women. The mainstream media is just in it for the money, of course. Women who feel like their bodies are fine the way they are won't go out and spend any money to pursue some ridiculous ideal. So it's not like it's some intentionally malicious behavior on the part of the media. They're amoral, with the single goal of making money.

On a related note, this is my main issue with mainstream hetero porn. I think that exposure to it over time causes men to equate the anorexic, surgically enhanced, 19-yr-old female body with female sexuality to the exclusion of all other body types. Of course they'll continue to "fuck" women who don't look like this, because they have no choice. But if the anorexic 19-yr-old is what they need to fantasize about, then the body of the average woman next to them is just being used as a masturbatory tool, which is why it can only be characterized as "fucking" in this case...

I think men need to start taking responsibility for this period. We need to stop the oogling and jacking off to porn and talking about how hot [insert actress/entertainer here] is in the company of other women.

In my defense, there are us male allies that do speak up when other men are being sexist, lookist scum. But it doesn't seem there are a whole lot of us. We've been so conditioned to check out other women it becomes a second nature that we have to fight continually. But, fighting that socialized reaction is something that I personally think has to be done if male allies want to walk the walk.


@Spike the cat:
I agree with you to an extent - that the perceived power that women have over men due to their looks is perceived, however you have to realize where the danger comes from. Until we can change our lookist society, we're teaching young women and girls that they should strive for power through looks, which causes eating disorders negative attention, plastic surgery, etc. etc.

@AbortionParty:
You're totally right. Until we (men) can stop watching porn and checking out other women with our female friends and partners, we're not doing our part to stop this lookist society.

[0+|0-] Author Profile Page gopher said:

I don't think porn is necessarily unhealthy. Its the type of porn that you watch that matters. Its when porn doesn't care about the womans pleasure or emphasizing it is when it becomes misogynistic. Also, the way that you filter porn is also what matters. For example, if I'm a guy raised in a traditional home and saturated by Girls Gone Wild culture and frat, childish privileged boy culture then I'm going to go after the misogynistic crap and interpret non-misogynistic porn within a misogynistic frame of mind.

But gopher, my point was not that mainstream hetero porn is misogynistic (although I agree that in some ways it is), but that it shapes the image of female sexiness in men's minds. The fact that the women in mainstream hetero porn don't seem to have their own desires other than pleasing men and putting on a show for them is also deeply problematic. But in this case I think the unhealthy aspect of porn is that it establishes one type of female body as being sexual and excludes all others.

[0+|0-] Author Profile Page Indecent Idealist said:

Standing ovation to Abortion Party!So yes, I blame men for this. I blame every single man who hates that this is how society lives and yet still finds it more worthy to wank off to porn or fantasize over Carmen Electra while having sex with his partner because these women are "hotter". I blame every man who tells his partner or female friend that she should be comfortable with how she looks, yet would ultimately prefer to turn his head to gaze longingly at a model. And I blame every man who whines that this is the standard attitude expected of his gender, yet he does nothing to stop it or change it."

EXACTLY.
"

Leave a comment