I don't really know what to say so I'll just begin and hopefully it'll flow. It's just about boys and having relationships with them...I don't necessarily mean all-out romantic and physical relations; just like, relating to them and being able to communicate and connect with them. I find this really hard to do and it's very frustrating sometimes.
There's this boy I like in my film production class. I think he likes me too. I definitely get the sense that he's attracted to me, at least. He's just my type; jokey and lighthearted, playful, even if he has a bit of a player persona (that is definitely NOT my type lol). I like those kind of guys because they're generally positive and fun to be around. Thing is, both of us like each other but it seems like we can never seem to let up our guard enough to get a good look at each other. Whenever we're alone or in a small group, he's really sweet and shy and it's obvious to me that he likes me. But then other times, he teases me (mildly, but still), or he just seems totally indifferent, even as if he's avoiding me. Now I know what you're all thinking. "Why are you even wasting your time, just forget about it, you deserve better etc. etc." But that's why it's hard for me to talk about this stuff with other girls; it's like I always feel like they're gonna tell me I'm stupid or weak for feeling a certain way. So that's why I wanted to share. I have to get over my fear of communicating openly and honestly with other girls....
Anyway, I'm just frustrated by how me and this guy obviously like each other/are attracted but we both seem to have walls up. Honestly he kinda scares me. I feel like if I made any indication as to how I feel, he would just laugh at me. I feel like I keep looking for clues that he definitely without a doubt likes me, so that maybe when I learn he does, I can finally make a move. I also don't feel like it's fair for him to have to keep making the first move; I don't want to have gender expectations, even though its WAY out of my own comfort zone to make the first move with guys.
Which brings me to my point. This is a pattern that seems to keep repeating with me and guys. Like I'll like the guy and be pretty sure he likes me, but then at some point i'll become terrified of him; that he's gonna ridicule me if he ever learns how i feel, or want to humiliate me in some way. And then I get hateful and resentful. I don't know why I have such strong emotions and fears. Well, obviously because we're in the midst of patriarchy that is constantly belittling women on every level every day. But I think it's also because I've heard so many horror stories from actual girlfriends about a**hole guys they've dated. One friend of mine told me about a friend of hers who lost her virginity to her boyfriend, only to learn that he TAPED them having sex on an audio cassette and then LET HIS FRIENDS LISTEN TO IT AT LUNCHTIME AT SCHOOL. Purportedly one of the guys friends later told her "I like how you sound." Horror story, no? Growing up, these kind of things stayed with me.
Whenever I do try to make convo with this guy or hint at something, I immediately feel all this anger or resentment toward him. I don't know why. It's like I feel like I'm walking into a trap; like once he knows he's caught me, he'll just laugh in my face and joke about it with his buddies. I always feel this way with guys, and it makes me terrified to make any kind of move. I always feel like they're just waiting to "conquer" me emotionally or physically and then laugh at me. It makes me so mad that I want to cry sometimes. I end up feeling very hateful and angry, and confused. I wonder whether he really did something to provoke such a reaction or whether it's my own fears and biases that are distorting my perceptions.
In the end, I don't know what to do about all these feelings. My experiences that I've had with him all seem to indicate that he's a kind and sweet guy. But his (and my) hot-cold behavior confuses me.
So anyways...I just wanted to share my little story. I Would love to hear any thoughts or similar stories. Thank you all.
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Sounds like straight up fear of rejection to me.
And thats really horrible what that guy did!
That story of the boy audio recording is truly horrendous.
I can understand why you'd be so nervous about approaching this guy you like. And there is the possibility that he might just laugh at you but do you have any indication that he might do this? Do other boys your age still do this now? Does the boy you like act differently when he's with his friends and does/act in a way that is not very nice? If not then I don't think you have to worry about much and I would suggest that you indicate that you like him. (like if he wants to hang out with you sometime, or study together outside of class, i have no idea. personally i'm more direct and i just say i like the person and wait for their reaction.)
There was two people I liked in high school but one moved away and for the other, I was too shy to say anything about my feelings to her. When I got to college I became less shy when it came to these things...anyway, the first guy I had a crush on in high school was hotandcold with me too (also the second crush too) and I both found out later that they both liked me too. Yeah it's confusing as heck but I hope you give it a go. :)
I understand how you feel. I have those same fears and doubts sometimes too. Personally I would advise you to continue to get to know this guy, even just as a friend. See how he acts around his friends and treats other girls. If he turns out to be an okay guy, go for it. If not, look for someone else.
He taped it? I can only imagine how horrible that must have been for her. I suppose she must now feel lucky that it wasn't a camera, and be careful with the next one.
The advice I would have for having sex with someone, if you're afraid of that happening to you, is to pick the location yourself, and while your kissing him press up against his front pockets and feel along his back pockets to make sure, but don't do that every time.
Ask him out, for crying out loud!
Isn't fair to say that you are "pre judging" this dude? There's a chance he is a really nice guy, and there's a chance he's a complete schmuck. Such is life. But give him a chance to prove he is a schmuck before thinking he is one!
But you said he "scares" you. If you are scared of being made a fool of, well, welcome to the human race. If there is more than that to the fear, be very careful, trust your instincts, and keep safe.
And maybe there are boys just looking to make fools out of girls. It's been a long time since I cared about stuff like that. I guess that is why they are called "boys" and not "men."
And we have all been made fools of. I hope to continue making a fool out of myself. I am right now! It's fun. And it gets easier with time.....
Oh, and btw, the guy with the recording, that is just lame.
He may be giving mixed signals so that he doesn't seem desperate. That's what men are told to do anyway.
You should ask him out. Rejection sucks, but it's better than your current relationship with him.
"Whenever I do try to make convo with this guy or hint at something, I immediately feel all this anger or resentment toward him. I don't know why. It's like I feel like I'm walking into a trap; like once he knows he's caught me, he'll just laugh in my face and joke about it with his buddies. I always feel this way with guys, and it makes me terrified to make any kind of move. I always feel like they're just waiting to "conquer" me emotionally or physically and then laugh at me. It makes me so mad that I want to cry sometimes. I end up feeling very hateful and angry, and confused."
You know its interesting, I've often heard this sentiment coming from guys. They express anger and resentment towards women because they feel that women have "power" over them through their sexuality, and they're afraid of being manipulated and mocked. I guess what I'm trying to say is that your reaction is a relatively common, if unfortunate one. No one likes to feel vulnerable, and fear very easily turns to misplaced anger. So, if this guy doesn't actually show any signs of being a tape recorder wielding asshole, just take a deep breath and move through your fear.
I agree completely, rhowan -- a lot of misogyny and (dare i say it?) misandry comes from a fear of the power dynamic that is implicit in liking someone who may or may not reject you.
I afraid that for all that it can and must and will do, feminism cannot change the fact that attraction is always experienced individually, unilaterally, and personally. Sometimes the other person shares that attraction, and people move forward -- and sometimes the other person does not, and the one who feels more will hurt most. To gender the power dynamic too much would be not only myopic, but it would also be to miss one of the most wonderful and terrible aspects of love.
You're clearly traumatized (and understandably so!) by the story of the audio recording. This is a violation. No doubt it was carried out by an otherwise "nice guy" (see discussion elsewhere in the community forum). Because the guy who did this is probably "ordinary", or "a regular guy", you are getting the impression this violation of women is what "regular guys" do, without batting an eyelash. I don't blame you for being freaked out. I'm getting freaked out myself.
Anyway, I'm just frustrated by how me and this guy obviously like each other/are attracted but we both seem to have walls up. [...] I feel like I keep looking for clues that he definitely without a doubt likes me, so that maybe when I learn he does, I can finally make a move.
First, admit that the mutual attraction isn't "obvious." It's okay that it isn't! That kind of certainty doesn't occur (if ever) until after both partners have made many, many, many moves. If you imagine love as chess (bleh, bear with me), certainty follows an endgame move; it doesn't authorize an opening gambit.
Most relationships I've ever been in happen almost imperceptibly. Two people kiss after holding hands after a touch on the arm or back or shoulder which usually comes after a lot of close sitting or standing or walking which comes after joking and teasing... and both parties make it happen little by little.
So invite him out for coffee, or sit close, or touch him in a friendly or casual way -- if he likes you, then even if he's shy, he will probably reciprocate in those little, non-threatening ways that build trust. We sometimes forget, but the preliminary stages (because they happen so slowly that those men and women who are selfish or manipulative often lose interest) can be more meaningful than you might expect.
That is a great point about mutual attraction not being obvious. Often, people see what they want to see especially in the beginning...
thank you Transcend! That was a very thoughtful comment. =) And illustrates very well my situation and how I feel about it...
I can totally relate to the way you feel about it. I've had similar experiences with two guys earlier. This one guy who lived on my floor in my dorm last year, although I'm not the best at reading signs, but the first time we saw each other was when I was walking upto the elevator with my roomie and there he was standing right in front of it.
I was talking to my roomie and was looking at her and then suddenly when I raised my head and looked it front, he was looking at me and we made eye contact for nearly 30 seconds until the elevator door opened up. And then inside it was awkward, there were others around us, we were still in front of each other.
I only found out the next day that he was on my floor when he was walking in the opposite direction than him and he said a quick hi and walked on by. I didn't think I was interested in him until the next weekend when I was returning to my room in the afternoon and as soon as I entered the elevator, a hand stopped the doors and he got in and I was in bad shape at that time, I felt like I looked my worst and I didn'tknow where to look while in the elevator, so I just looked in front, and out of the corner of my eye, I could see him looking at me a couple of times and once we got out of the elevator on our floor, I could see him smiling from the side, I didn't know why though, I don't know what it means when a guy smiles to himself, could it've been a smirk or something he was happy about? I couldn't tell, but he seemed like a really wonderful guy (although most people would think I was being presumptuous here) and almost perfect, although I never got a chance to get to know him.
We kept running into each other occasionally, but I could never get myself to even say hi to him because thereafter whenever I saw him, I would try to say hi back, but my voice wouldn't leave my throat, at least I couldn't hear it. And I would feel so dumb soon after. I was always so concerned about what he was thinking of me. Later things got weird between us because I finally derived the courage to actually go upto him and introduce myself, but that never worked out for us. There were so many instances when I could've but never had the guts to.
So I really think that you should definitely try to make some conversation with him, even if it is on some pretext, you never know where small talk could lead you.
And I know what you mean when you say that it's hard to talk to other girls about it because whenever I've talked about my experience with this guy (whom I don't even know the name of), sadly they're less than encouraging, they think I'ma lways making too much of a small thing. Sometimes, I feel like they are trying to say that I couldn't be good enough for any of the guys I think I might like. It doesn't matter to me anymore, because I've learned since then to trust my instincts/judgment more than what others will tell me. But every now and then I wish there was someone who would be a little more encouraging and tell me to follow my heart and encourage me to go and talk to the guys I think I like. So, I really recommend you talk to him as soon as you can so you don't have to worry about the 'what if's' later in your life...trust me, it's not fun!