The post about taking up space reminded me of the comments I get from just about everyone (except my fellow feminists!) about my burping and other "un-ladylike" things. If I'm with my friends or family, I burp. If I remember, I'll follow it with an "excuse me", but either way, I'm ALWAYS accused of being un-ladylike. The same goes for when I announce to my friends/family that I have to pee (excuse me, but I drink alot and I therefore have to pee alot). The older men in my family are constantly "correcting" me, saying how it is un-ladylike to announce such a thing. I should be saying "I have to use the restroom." HOWEVER, those same men/boys can go on half hour long conversations about their farts or bowel movements. They then turn to my mother, complaining that she didn't "raise me right", because she was apparantly supposed to raise me to act like a lady.
So as far as they are concerned, being a woman means not having basic human bodily functions, or at least not talking about them. As if for us its disgusting, but for them, its admirable. Me and my fellow strong women have burping contests, just like the boys. If the older men in my family were to see that, one can only imagine what they'd think.
It just makes me so angry, the double standards and the ridiculous expectations for women who should be "ladies." Does anyone else deal with such things?


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Oh dear. Where does one start?
There is nothing admirable in mimicking men's more unsavoury straits. Burping, farting, bragging about it, etc. are not very pleasant, in men or in women.
I find it surprising and slighty alarming that you feel that adopting such behaviour is somehow an aspiration for you. Don't! Resist! Refuse!
By all means, go for equality, but don't believe that all of the men's traits, behaviours, attitudes and ways of acting should be adopted wholesale.
Be more choosy! Take what you like, take what you like, and leave the rest. Don't let your clan pull you down to the level of the worst group!
And be proud to stand out form your family crowd by your better behaviour.
I think you're being a bit unfair to the OP. She might be trying to mimic men's behavior, but then again she might just enjoy burping. Why are you so sure she's not taking what she likes? I definitely agree however that people shouldn't take pride in doing something simply because it's a traditionally male behavior.
And I totally get what the OP is saying about double standards, but I don't think not being obnoxious about bodily functions is an 'excessive expectation.' I personally wish it was an expectation of everybody, male or female. I don't really want to hear anyone talk for 30 minutes about their bowel movements or announce exactly what they're going to do in the bathroom. To be clear I'm talking about when people go out of their way to be gross about it (i.e. intentionally farting or announcing that they're going to take a shit), not just normal daily functions.
Yeah, I think burping contests are gross no matter who engages in them.
AGREED.
Men need more politeness expected of them in public. Women don't need to go around burping and farting and being disgusting to have rudeness-equality.
Yuck.
Yeah, I agree with you, those aren't things to aspire to, but I got the impression the OP's family was coming down on her when they just happened. Everyone has to burp or pee at times and they're telling her just the basic functions are unladylike, while having a double standard for the guys in her family. That's not right.
I'm so tired of holding in my farts in public and waiting to poop until I get home. I'm tired of being embarrassed if I let a burp out accidently, and being too ashamed to have fun with my ability to burp at will. It's not that I want to discuss the properties of a truly disgusting fart for 3 hours or have a toast to some other body function. I just want to be able to function and not be embarrassed. I remember being really hungry during classes and trying to hide when my stomach would start growling loudly. I can't help it if my stomach is REALLY loud, but the fact that it made noise made me unlady-like. I get really embarrassed when I smell someone else's gas in public, because I'm afraid other people will think it's mine. Then I'm annoyed because someone else had the audacity to fart in public while I'm in pain from trying to keep my gas from exploding out my ass while I search frantically for a bathroom. I've had people glare at me when I wipe my nose with a tissue because it's runny while in public but I've witnessed countless men pick their noses one way or another whenever they feel like it. I stopped wearing certain kinds of sandals even though they are soooo comfortable because they make my feet smell, but I know lots of guys that think that nasty odor is awesome and try to stick their feet in other people's faces so they can share the experience. WTF.
I don't think there's anything admirable in making myself feel sick because of social and cultural expectations. Right now, as I'm typing this, my stomach still hurts because I suffered the last few hours at work containing gas and a bowel movement. I've been uncomfortable for several hours because it's not ladylike to pass gas in public or do more than pee in a restroom outside your home. Is anyone really surprised that women are much more likely to suffer from IBS? That's one feminist goal I am working on, though slowly, to accept the functions of my body and forgive myself if my body functions publicly. I'm not going out of my way to be disgusting, but I don't want to make myself sick or hurt myself to fit into a lady-like mold that doesn't really work for me. And if I do accidentally let a really loud, smelly fart out, instead of getting embarrassed and wishing I were dead, I'm gonna laugh my ass off with my husband, who I know will be impressed enough for the both of us.
"[...] my stomach still hurts because I suffered the last few hours at work containing gas and a bowel movement."
If I may ask: where do you work?
Do people really expect women not to take a shit in public restrooms? I've never heard that before. It doesn't even make sense cause who would notice (besides maybe the person in the next stall)
marie123: Yes, sadly, I have seen this expectation that women aren't supposed to use public restrooms. It is a strange idea, and I don't exactly understand where it would have come from.
I understand people not wanting to have to deal with bodily functions all the time, but we all need to be able to do them without getting grief from others, if we are male or female.
I am a frequent belcher, and can compete with the best of the boys. When people tell me it isn't lady like, my response (as taught to me by my mother and her co-worker): holding it in makes you sick/causes cancer. There is no scientific backing behind my statement, but it lightens the mood.
Also learned from my mother and grandmother. "Never marry a man who you can't fart in front of." People who are close to you should understand that bodily functions are a necessary part of life. If they can't deal with you being heathy and comfortable, there is something seriously wrong.
My dad used to terrorize my mom and I by making such a huge deal about his gas. I might be scarred, lol. I don't think people should have to hold anything in, but I don't see why he needed to always make a big production out of it either. He's calmed down now that he's older though.
The double standard is definitely complete b.s.
And being "ladylike" is unsustainable over time. We're only setting ourselves up for humiliation once sphincters loosen up---oh and they will, they will.
People unfortunately also take the concept of "ladylike" too far. Case in point: I was reading on a forum just the other day about women being ashamed of the air that escapes from the vagina after the partner withdraws in a doggystyle position. Absurd, no?--especially considering how the air got in there in the first place.
I never understood why normal functions can't be talked about or done? People belch. People pee. It's not a big deal. For it only to be things that men talk about and deal with is pretty stupid.
That being said, belching everywhere is kinda nasty if only because they can sometimes smell and they're loudly disruptive.
I don't think women should be ladylike, but everyone should make an effort to be classy, it's not funny when 13 year old boys have burping contests, its not funny when considerably older ladys do it either. Also, how is having basic manners wrong exactly?
I think there are two separate issues at work here. One is relevant to feminism and is the double standard the OP is talking about. She is absolutely correct that there exists a double standard where many behaviors overlooked, applauded, or simply ignored when men do them are unthinkable for women. This is a CLASSIC example of the social construct of gender and how we masculinize or feminize something as (ridiculously) natural as gas.
The other issue is...well..I don't even know how to label it. I'd say manners but the fact is that manners themselves are social constructs bathed with misogynist undertones. But this second, and less important issue, is one of collective appropriateness:
Fact: No one should have to abstain from allowing their bodies to function normally. Fact: Gas smells. Fact: No one wants to smell anyone else's gas. That may be another reason why even some men are embarrassed at the thought of taking a bowel movement in a public restroom (my brother is a good example).
While there certainly should exist no double standard, there is also the commonly accepted notion that NO ONE, male or female or genderqueer or anything in between, NO ONE should be so rude as to purposely pass gas loudly or belch for entertainment. Honestly, we're talking about odorous gases laced with fecal matter. It's not a "share the love" kind of moment for anyone.
That being said, if we live in a society where offensive, gross, revolting behaviors are acceptable for males but not for females, and if we cannot idealize a world in which the gross behavior goes away, then by all means, females should burp and fart away!
ChrissyR: Be proud and stand your ground.
I'm the same. If I'm in public, I try to be discreet about it, but at home and with family, it's no-holds-barred.
Heck, my mother and I terrorise my sister by insinuating about our sex lives in front of her. She's very ladylike (and I envy her that some days), whereas the rest of my immediate family (mum, dad and myself) are less inhibited in each other's presence.
Frankly, it's nothing to be ashamed of (at least among family and close friends), so tell them to "get fkd" next time they go off at you for it.
My mother tried to make me and my sister ladylike, and utterly failed. Probably due to my father, who's always belching, peeing, farting, picking his nose and talking about it and encouraging us to do the same since we were kids. I wonder if that contributed to me being not very uppity and refined and being a feminist.I'm like Sonja, if I'm at home I'll go at it, but if I'm in public I'll hold it more. I have a body that burps and farts and that's part of being alive, means it's alive.Enjoy it. Any of you capable of belching names ?
I love talking about politics, religion, and other deep topics like that, but whenever I start talking about it around this guy I know, Michael, he always tells me I'm being un-ladylike. It's really annoying because those thoughts are completely outdated, and I almost can't believe my ears anytime he says stuff like that.
Regarding the original post, I just don't think it's polite to talk about stuff like that, no matter what gender(s) you identify yourself with. I mean, I realize that people have those bodily functions, but I just don't like talking about them. But to each his/her own.
the belief that burping or farting or any mention of bodily functions is 'crass' is a culturally conditioned thing. just farting or burping or saying 'i have to pee' isn't the same thing as a farting or burping contest. there's a difference between just farting like it was something bound to happen and just a part of life and making some performance out of it.