I don't know how people meet all these people like them either. I've met one person who takes ideas of social justice- not even feminism specifically- as seriously as I do, and that was in the last year. But my experience hasn't been with real assholes, just people who don't think about this stuff.

As for the choice, personally, I'd go with no friends in a heartbeat, just because I can get my fill of necessary human contact through relatively superficial means with people I'll never see again. Walking around the store or the mall for a while is good enough. You may not be wired the same way, but if you've never tried not being attached to anyone locally, I'd suggest it. It's not too tough once you're used to it. If your coworkers are that bad, maybe it would be a relief to not deal with anybody like that away from work.

Besides, there's still this interweb thing. Obviously people who aren't like those you're dealing with exist; you can see that anytime you come here, at minimum. It's not the same as being able to talk to someone up close, but if you run on the assumption that not everyone is a highly-skilled troll, you'd have to run across someone you might be inclined to meet in real life, various factors allowing. Is that a viable possibility for you?

The other thing- and I don't like sounding critical about someone who's venting, but it really caught my eye- is how you say you hang on to people who indicate they "don't completely hate" you. I'm by no means assuming you go overboard and act all clingy, but is it possible that when you do meet such people, in trying to keep them around, a perception of desperation peeks through?

Note that I say "perception". When I moved out to California, I blew a few potential friendships. I acted in a way that felt pretty normal to me, putting in some amount of effort to be friends, but the people involved started acting like I was weird. In retrospect, I suppose it was in part because I only had one friend out here, but it was also the case that I simply acted the way I do with my friends back home. I know that, to some degree, it looked like I was trying too hard. But it never occurred to me at the time because it was what I had always considered normal. Best intentions, etc.

No friends was better for me. I didn't realize how much energy I was spending on people I didn't like. Sure, I liked them some of the time, but they only liked me some of the time. It got truly wearing.

So, when I moved away, I just didn't bother to keep up with the "friends" I didn't like. I had one or two that I did like (loved, actually), but I was far from them, too. I did not go out of my way to make friends after I moved. I found other things to do that actually seemed to make me happier in my own life. I suddenly had energy to write and discover new things that I had never had the time to give a chance to before. I found new interests and whole new groups of people that I actually respected. I began interact with them and found that I was becoming someone that I respected.

Sure, there were lots of times that I was lonely. But, as they say, "Being lonely is better than being miserable." Sure was true for me. And I found that I'm never as lonely by myself, doing things that I really like to do, as I am when I'm in a group of people I dislike and don't respect.

(As for coworkers, be the person that they can't make rape jokes in front of. Some will talk bad about it, but you're in the right. And you might even find that others will start seeking out your company because you've made a stand about it. I sure would if I worked with you. That way, you'll find people you never would know that you get along well with.)

Bottom line, don't compromise. You'll find like-minded people eventually and you'll actually have the time and clarity to recognize them when they come along.

If your co-workers are making rape jokes around you, start making comments about going to the HR department and talking about a hostile work environment. There's nothing like the threat of getting lawyers involved to get people to shut up. And, if they don't stop, carry out your threat.

But yeah, humans are bastards.

I am glad that this is a place you can come to vent. I do. I live in a fairly rural area, among people of strongly traditional cultures, and even among my 90% female coworkers in healthcare, tradition is the name of the game. Abortion? Won't hear of it. It blew their minds I believed in choice. Sex jokes. Race jokes. Queer jokes. Ablism. Class privilege. Sexism on both sexes. Office politics. On and on. They open up the newspaper in the break room just to point out something new and go, "What's the matter with these crazy people nowadays?"

I don't think any of us can answer this question for you, katemoore. At least, I know I can barely answer it for myself.

I was very lonely where I am for a long time. Finally, I made one friend but, well, I wrote about it all on my blog. I had to decide the same thing as you, whether to be lonely or try to be friends with someone who seemed to hate everything about me. In the end, she made the choice for me, because I knew no amount of apologizing would convince her to change her mind or make me comfortable with her again, but it was a really depressing experience. I don't know if I would have had the strength to stop being friends with her if it weren't for my husband backing me up all the way; we're social beings, after all...

Finally, I managed to get over my shyness enough to make a couple of friends. Unfortunately, the only way to meet people who don't hate you is to keep meeting new people, and I know you've talked about your anxiety as a major barrier, but maybe the Internet can help (like Spiffy said) or doing your best to meet people in situations where you are as comfortable as possible.

Personally, I'm a lot better one-on-one with people than I am in big groups of strangers; I met one friend in my school darkroom where it was only ever just me and him (didn't even talk to him the first several times I saw him because I was too nervous but he started talking to me and I did my best to not do the stuff that makes people never talk to me again). Another friend was actually my teacher first and I don't find teachers anywhere near as intimidating as other people because I automatically have the class that I can talk to them about to avoid those awkward silences; I had also met her partner previously and knew she was interested in a lot of the same things I am, so when that class ended I suggested we meet for coffee, just the two of us - and now we're friends, even though it has taken me about 6 months to really not feel too shy with her.

But the awful/awesome thing about social anxiety like you and I have is that it tends to show you who is an asshole really quick. Maybe that's why it seems like everyone around you is, more than other people: maybe everyone who says they have lots of friends who are similar to them just hasn't had to face the truth.

What do you do? You grow a damn spine, quit getting pissy at those of us who have managed, through trial and error and hurt or lost friendships (did you really think we all just fell into groups of perfect feminist friends from Day 1?), to have a group of progressive friends, and you choose what matters to you more: bodies to interact with, or your principles?

As for how to find the kind of people you want, the "duh" answer for how to collect a progressive group of friends is, get involved. Go work for any of a dozen progressive organizations, as a volunteer. Meet the other volunteers. Meet the paid workers. Try to strike up friendships. There are still assholes who work at places like that, but your odds of meeting genuine feminists or progressives are significantly higher.

But you know, you might want to not be a snippy asshole and all "throw yourselves a party" when you're, y'know, ASKING THE COMMUNITY FOR ADVICE AND HELP. Just a thought. Politeness, and keeping a lid on the self-pity, goes a long way.

Dear katemoor,
I feel for you. I can't tell you how many times in my life I've found myself friendless and lonely (again). It's miserable, and it makes me sick to think of other people feeling the same way that I have/do. I'm sorry that for you the feministing community hasn't been one where you have found support.

Which says to me that it is time to find a community that WILL support you. I don't know where you live, but if it is anywhere remotely suburban/urban, there must be an aspergers/autism support group within a reasonable distance of you. I feel that there, you might be able to find genuinely compassionate and good people.

This isn't victim blaming, I swear. This isn't me saying, "omgoaweds, it couldn't be that bad" because I know it is. I'm saying this because I wish someone would have an idea for me where I could meet people that completely don't suck. and at a support group, you might meet people that actually get it.

Good luck, and i wish you the best.

I wonder to what extent you might be able to see some of these difficult situations as opportunities to bring your passion and your particular consciousness to the fore. And this might be difficult to balance, as you've already hinted at, because there's a fine line between asserting one's principles because you won't be able to forgive yourself if you don't, and getting through a work day or a simple interaction in life.

I've been there where my only two choices were anti-feminist people or no people at all - but I eventually had to make sure that I wasn't dismissing people because they've laughed at a joke I didn't like or have done something sexist or have passively approved of something sexist. I'm not saying this is what you're doing, because I'm not you, but we have to be careful nonetheless that we aren't defining people, and ultimately who we want to interact with or be friends with, based on their (dis)interest in feminism. And I don't think people want to be defined in one way, either.

But anyway, everybody needs a support system. I would suggest, though, that the iconic feminist closeness you seem to be observing can be overstated and, in my opinion, harmful at times. Sometimes feminists don't know when to break the huddle they've comfortably formed for themselves, so "carving out a wonderful niche" of other feminists can be great for support and to have a network of people who understand you, but there are also downsides to striving for this. I think your statement that "some people take what they get" as far as support goes rings true for many people, and I say right on. Maybe while other feminists are hanging out celebrating being feminists together, as you've imagined or observed, you are the one actually busy doing some serious work toward the cause.

I get where you're coming from. My family is profoundly anti almost every value I hold and it is very difficult to have a conversation about things that mean a lot to me with them.

I think you've come to the right place. One of the fantastic things about the internet is that it enables people to make connections. My experence though is that most people just take their cultural mores for granted.

The ones who want more show up in places like this. It's not perfect. But it's something.

I've been trying to accomplish the same goal, more or less. Check out meetup.com, there may be a feminist group in your city.

It sounds like your social group is well aware of your interest in feminism, but how explicitly aware are all of your coworkers? I was really surprised to find one feminist ally among my friends when I started mentioning my burgeoning interest in feminism. If you get on well with some of them sometimes, you might try feeling them out about it, away from the group on the whole.

Goodluck!

Well, if your only options are "anti-feminist friends" or "no friends," then you're locking yourself in a shitty situation no matter what. Option three would be to look for a feminist group in your area and join it. Maybe your local Planned Parenthood has some volunteer opportunities.

I have no answers for you. But I would like to tell you I completely understand what you are talking about. I go to college in a small town and no one here seems to think about social issues at all. They all are, with very few exceptions, extremely ignorant and bigoted. They get angry and decide I am not worthy to hang out with if I ever say anything about it. I cannot be myself around anyone, therefore, I have no friends at school pretty much. It really, really sucks. :(

I wish I had a solution. I usually just satisfy myself by reading this site and making myself realize there are people out there that agree with me, and that I am a good person... whether or not people here realize it.

I figure I'll just respond en masse here.

1. This post was written at about 2 a.m. when I wasn't in the best state. I tried to clarify this in the title. I obviously failed.

2. I live in the South. I can count the number of feminist groups in my hometown on one hand, and that's if you really stretch the definition of "feminist." There's a group at my college but I went to a few meetings and the people there did not like me very much, so I didn't go back. Now, I have a conflict at that time that prevents me from going back anyway. Furthermore, policies at work prevent me from being visibly involved with political groups. Feminism falls under that category, see bullet 5.

3. As most of my comments would indicate, I have been diagnosed with Asperger's for about 15 years now. So it's altogether possible - and probable - that I come off as desperate, but that's because I am. It's one of those things where you do not, and cannot know what it's like. But this leads to...

4. The Asperger's community is full of too much misogynistic bullshit for me to identify with it, and furthermore, I am in support of a cure, which is another major wedge.

5. The HR people are just as bad as the rest of my coworkers. They don't make rape jokes -- well, I'm sure they do but I haven't been around for them -- but they would not be receptive to this particular concern. And if I came out as a feminist, it'd do nothing for my relationship with my coworkers, whom I kind of would like to get along with.

i totally felt this way when i first landed in college and in high school also actually. i think doing political activities definitely helped me find like minded people who were at least open to the idea of me saying 'can you not joke about that around me? it freaks me out'. over time i've managed to get an awesome circle of friends. i realize how lucky i am. but really, that's how i got my proverbial foot in the door to getting some cool, reliable, fun, and amazing friends. political activities and volunteering (and a group on meetup.com actually). (oh and in women's studies classes!).

I sympathize with this a lot. Living in the South makes finding like-minded friends exponentially more difficult. And even though my conservative friends and relatives exhaust me most of the time I still consider my relationships with them to be valuable.

I grew up in the South and went to school in California. When I moved back home after school my college friends were shocked. "How can you stand to be around THOSE people?" they howled. Here's the thing: THOSE people are my family, my friends, my kindergarten teacher, my coworkers and my neighbors. I care about them and they are a part of my life. They are not a caricature of a backward, racist, sexist, zealot who hates everyone with a different worldview. I have disagreements with them to be sure. There have been plenty of arguments at family gatherings but they are usually willing to listen. More importantly, they support me unconditionally regardless of whether or not they actually agree with me. A few years a go a staunchly anti-choice family friend made a very generous contribution to Planned Parenthood in my name because I told her that's what I wanted for Christmas.

I know not every relationship with anti-feminist friends and family is like this. There's a reason I left for California in the first place. I was looking for a quick fix; an escape from an oppressive and often hostile environment. But ultimately I am more fulfilled here even though I'm literally surrounded by über-conservatives as I type this response. Sometimes it feels like a endless battle and I dream of escaping to blue state again. Still, at the end of the day, my life is here in the South and I'm happy for that.

I choose no friends at all since I've spent most of my life with none so I'm used to it.

Speaking up can be a form of activism as well- you just have to be careful how you word it so that they'll be receptive. Don't deny yourself friendships, they make life beautiful- and furthermore, it's important to be with people you don't always agree with so as to not get stuck in your ideological head space. There's also little point in preaching to the converted. We all do things that might be considered "un-feminsit"- hence the un feminist guilty pleasures columns on this website. None of our horses are that high.

Have you tried looking on meetup.com for feminist groups in your area? Or even posting one on there and seeing if anyone else is interested?

My question is, what do you do when your two choices are anti-feminist friends or no friends at all?

I think you're being a bit more polarizing about this than is necessary. For example, as other commenters said, just because many women don't self-identify as feminist doesn't mean they have absolutely zero feminist beliefs or tendencies at all. I have some vaguely homophobic friends/coworkers who throw around the word 'slut' more than I'd like (less so around me, since I've specifically asked them not to) but who are still strongly pro-choice and have much to say about the objectifying/sexualizing of women in media and culture. There really is no "I have all feminist friends, and you don't," because people's belief systems just don't work this way. And, again, "feminism" is not a very simple, easy-to-define monolith.

I like to put myself in a teaching position when I can, when others are open to it, and part of this is remembering that people's views don't change overnight. Still, just your briefly SAYING or explaining something can plant a seed; there's no need to rail on it. And part of this is, of course, learning when to let things go, even when you're pissed off. (Though it's useful to figure out where your boundaries are. e.g., I would do what I could to point out if someone was rape-victim-blaming, but if it continued past all my reasoning, I simply would get up and leave or try to put an end to the conversation.)

I stick onto those friends who I have the most in common with, and thus far that has been other women I've met at college and in doing volunteer work at the Women's Center. Definitely consider volunteering somewhere woman-oriented (Planned Parenthood, a domestic violence shelter), if you have the time, or try to frequent feminist events in town, if any. You'll meet lots of great people who do share your feminist views. They're out there. :o)

Well, as someone who is completely socially inept, I understand. Not that we have the same problem, but I dounderstand you still. I have social anxiety, so meeting new people is very hard for me. Actually, it's so hard that if I actually meet another feminist, I'd be so intimidated by her/him that I'd just stop the relationship completely. So I know what it's like to just try to be satisfied with anyone...
Luckily, however, I have ONE friend who I can talk to about feminism, and is interested in my beliefs and/or understands. She doesn't call herself a feminist, though.

Have you tried meetup groups? There's almost always a feminist group.
How about just moving? That's pretty much what I did. I had female friends who actually thought it was funny when I said their were sexist. She actually thought it was a cute trait that would make relationships with men easier... =\
And, seriously, how many rape jokes can people make? Geez... How can people be so damn stupid and lack so much empathy to not stop when someone directly tells them their offended by it? You know, I say just stay friendless... For your own sake.

My advice is cultivate online friendships (they are not the same as real-life friendships but the can be very rewarding in themselves), take up hobbies (like a book club) and keep trying.

I think the hardest thing for you might be seeing that just because somebody is offensive or sometimes anti-feminist they might not be all bad. People are not all good or all bad. They have different parts of them that are good or bad within them. They might make offensive jokes all the time but also be a patient person who listens well. You have to choose your friends carefully and tolerate the bad parts to have access to the good.

Some friends might be too different to you for you to keep. You don't have to hang out with those people just because they seem to like you. As hard as it can be it's better to have one less friend than a friend who always makes you feel bad.

Good luck, keep trying and keep reaching out.