So I did something really stupid a little over a month ago and I'm pretty embarrassed to admit it. I slept with an ex-boyfriend that I absolutely do not like. Not only do I not like him, thinking about what I did makes me want to throw up. And the aftermath of it all is just...I feel like it's all totally my fault. Like I deserve it for doing something so stupid. It's horrible and I don't know what to do.
Just some quick background on this ex: we dated for about a year on and off when I was 19 (I'm 26 now) and had a really rocky relationship. He cheated on me but still to this day will never admit it. I also cheated on him once and did admit it. He also became a compulsive liar about anything and everything while we were together. During the end of our relationship he started to get really angry and yell a lot, though he never became violent towards me (though he was a fan of punching walls and doors). When we broke up we kind of remained friends because we were friends with the same people. Then one night he kicked a chair at my head, and missed instead hitting and denting the ceiling, because of some "mixed signals" he said I gave him and since that time our friendship has been strained to say the least. He'd still call every once in a while to invite me to hang out though I'd always turn him down. But we'd basically talk maybe once every six months online for about 5 minutes.
Anyway...I was completely drunk and it had been a while since I had gotten laid. I was coming home from a baseball game on the train and I ran into him. He was looking pretty good (or at least I think he was, my memory is pretty fuzzy) and I remember thinking, "Okay, I could have sex with him. It'd be okay." Well, I invited him back to my place and I don't remember much after that at all. I don't remember kissing and I definitely don't remember the sex. The only reason I know it happened was that I woke up naked and there was a used condom in my trash can. Thankfully he was gone in the morning though. Needless to say I woke up with a huge hangover and even though I saw that we used a condom and I was on birth control I ran to Walgreens and immediately purchased some Plan B. There was no way in hell I was getting pregnant with this asshole's kid.
So I thought that was it. I was in the clear. I had done something really regrettable and stupid but it was over now and I could forget about it. But no. That's when the phone stalking happened.
The day of my hangover he called me around 1:00. I didn't pick up. He left a message saying he just wanted to make sure I wasn't too hungover. Okay, that didn't sound too bad, but I still didn't want to talk to him. He called again around 4:00. I didn't pick up. No message this time.
He texted me two days later, a Saturday, around 8:00 at night. He wanted to know what I was doing. At first I wasn't going to respond. But then I decided to text back, thinking it was the only way to get him to leave me alone. So I texted that I was staying in because I was tired. He texted back something along the lines of how he was going to come over to my place and make me come out. I could tell he was joking but I didn't respond.
He texted me again the next Thursday night. He wanted me to come out. I didn't respond because it was already 9:00 and I had work the next day. And I didn't want to hang out with him.
At this point, I started to worry that he's thinking we're getting back together or something. Part of me wanted to tell him flat out that that night was a mistake and I don't like him and never will. But I'm really scared of him. Our past history makes me nervous around him and the only reason I wasn't that one time is because I was so drunk I couldn't think straight.
The next night, Friday, I go out with my friends from work to a loud and crowded bar. I can't hear my phone in my purse. By the time we leave the bar late at night I check my phone to see if I've missed any calls. He has called me 7 times. He's left 3 messages. At this point my heart started to beat kind of fast. Maybe he saw me in the bar. Maybe the messages are him cursing me out. I deleted the missed calls and decided not check the voicemails.
Saturday I was taking it easy just lounging around my apartment. Doing a bit of cleaning. The phone rang at 3:00, 5:00, 5:30, 6:00, 8:00, 11:00, 11:15, and 12:30 (these are all approximate guesstimates but you get the idea, he did call 8 times). ALL HIM. 2 more voicemails! It got to be that when each time my phone rang I would jump. I'd be afraid to look at the caller ID. It was always him. I didn't leave my apartment that day because I was afraid he was outside or something just waiting for me. Again, I deleted the calls and decided not to listen to the messages.
On Sunday he called 3 more times and left one more message. Part of me wanted to send him a text saying leave me alone but I didn't know what that would do, if that would make him angry or what. Since I hadn't listened to his messages I had no idea what was going on. And I didn't want to listen to his messages because I was so scared.
Monday came and went without any calls or texts. I was relieved enough that I was able to listen to the voicemails. They were all pretty normal, which creeped me out more than I thought they would. They just said "Hey, it's me. Just wondering what you're up to. Call me back." Or more or less. But the last one was different. He sounded angrier. "I've called you at almost every hour of the day. I don't know what your problem is or when you're available. Call me."
Well I knew I couldn't call him. He gets really angry and intimidating and I was more scared of him now than I ever had been. I mean, this was stalking me. I wanted it to stop. I wanted him to go away. But somehow I felt like it was all my fault because I had made this stupid mistake of letting him back into my life. I had confused him. I brought this on myself. That's what he'd say. I'm to blame.
The calls and texts have died down a bit now. I haven't received the crazy amount like I did since that weekend, which is great. But they haven't ended. The main problem is I know eventually, sometime soon, I'm probably going to see him again. A mutual friend (one of my best friends) is coming home next month (he lives in Korea) and I just know that there will be an occasion where the two of us will wind up in the same room together. I honestly don't know what to do. I don't want another chair kicked at my head. I don't want him yelling at me for it being all my fault. No one deserves to be stalked like that. I've been contemplating just sending him a text saying that he really creeped me out with that barrage of calls or something, but I don't know. I just want it to go away. I want it to have never happened.
I'm sorry this is so long but I just needed to get this out. I need some support or just someone to listen or share a similar story, anything really.
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what a terrible situation. this guy definitely sounds like a loose-cannon, who can blame you for not wanting to hang out with him or call him back? you're hooking up with him again (mistake or not) *may* have sent the wrong initial message, but i think you ignoring him completely also sent a message. it's REALLY scary to have to call someone and tell them to back off. or even text them when they're super scary and you don't know whether or not they may hurt you. do you have any mutual friends that know the situation who could call him for you and be honest, say he's scaring you a little, you're having a hard time, and could he not contact you? if nobody knows this is happening, that's not good. you should definitely talk to someone, even if you feel embarrassed about what happened. just so someone knows what you're dealing with! good luck, so sorry this is happening.
Yes, tell someone you trust just in case something crazy happens. If you really wish not to hear from him or see him anymore, I recommend sending him a text message (if you don't want to talk to him on the phone) telling him that you do not wish to hear from him anymore. Be clear and concise. Do it in a nice way if you are afraid of his reaction. KEEP IT ON YOUR PHONE. After you have told him to stop, keep records of all contact that is made and DO NOT respond in any way.
If he continues to harass you a lot after you have told him not to contact you and you are afraid of what he might do, I recommend talking to someone about getting a harassment restraining order. They can offer advice and maybe offer some resources, as well as help you write an order if you wish to. It doesn't go on his record and then you'll have legal recourse if he continues to harass you.
Here's a link to an information packet on stalking that I think may be helpful: http://www1.umn.edu/aurora/pdf/StalkingInfoPacket.pdf
How in the world is it your fault? Put those thoughts out of your mind! Even if he was someone you WERE interested in seeing again and being involved with, getting 7 calls to your phone in one evening when you couldn't hear it ring would probably have your creepiness-radar pinging. I once met a seemingly nice guy at a party, gave him my phone number, and he called it 4 times in a row a few mornings later before I'd even woken up, leaving a voicemail each time wondering where I was and why I wasn't returning his calls. I'd been perfectly interested in meeting him for coffee before that, but afterwards...
I agree with everyone above that you should tell someone you trust and keep records of what's going on.
Alixana you're totally right and I know I shouldn't even think that it's my fault, but I can't help it. That's why the two people I've told (one guy and one girl), even though they're my good friends, I've left out the part about me sleeping with him. I can just hear them blaming me, or at least partially blaming me for what's going on. Maybe I'm wrong and they wouldn't do that, I don't know. But I know some people would. Some of my old friends would. They would say that I knew he was violent. That I knew he was scary and creepy. That I should've known better. I know this is complete victim blaming BS but it's hard to be completely immune, ya know? I'm not even mentioning the fact that he was completely sober and I was basically black out drunk. Ugh, this whole thing is so shitty and makes me feel so shitty.
There's a difference between putting yourself in a bad situation and being at fault for something. You may be guilty of the former, but not the latter. While that concept hopefully helps you not consider yourself at fault, it's mostly something you can tell other people who try to blame you for it.
"Well, if you hadn't slept with him, this wouldn't have happened."
"Just because I put myself in a bad position doesn't mean it's my fault he's stalking me. He could have slept with me without texting and calling me all the time afterwards. That's on him."
etc, etc.
I will agree, though, with those saying you need to tell him flat-out to stop trying to contact you. If he's really batshit psycho, nothing you do is going to truly affect what he does, so at least give yourself the out that you told him to bug off. And if he's at least marginally capable of reason, it's probably the best way to get him to leave you be.
Thanks hellotwin and preppy for responding so quickly.
A little more information:
I have told two friends about what has been happening although I have left out the key detail that I slept with this guy recently because I was embarrassed. I just mentioned running into him and striking up a drunken conversation and the ensuing phone calls. So they just think it's really weird he's called so much (and I haven't let on how scared I am). One knows him but is not his friend, in fact he very much dislikes him (the other never met him). Also, the mutual friends that this ex and I used to have, we don't have anymore (aside from the guy living in Korea). So telling someone to talk to him for me wouldn't work.
I have talked to a lawyer about the situation (my other friend is a lawyer) but unfortunately since I was so scared when the original barrage of calls came in I deleted all the evidence of the stalking and harrassment. I've started saving them now, but my phone deletes my call list after about 5 days as it is. But now he doesn't call much so there's really nothing to be done.
Mostly I'm just afraid of what might happen if I run into him at some point. We're from the same town and I've run into him many many times when I'm home visiting my parents (they live in a suburb of the city I live in now) or just around Chicago. I know it's almost impossible to never see him again.
I think the key is to tell him you aren't interested and that it was a mistake. Usually that's all someone like this wants to hear. He is most likely sitting there thinking, why can't you at least be honest with me and tell me how you feel. And he won't give up until you do this. I've seen this situation before with both genders and seen it stop as soon as this is done or seen someone confess that is all they wanted.
So I think he is waiting for this, and part of him wants to punish you until you just admit you don't want to see him. That or I suppose it's remotely possible he really is that dense and doesn't realize the situation (I have actually encountered such a thing) and/or is really hurt about things went down and just really wants to talk to you about it.
Your best bet is to just tell him you aren't interested in seeing him anymore. It may not stop him from calling, but until you do that he has alot better case to keep calling. He can convince himself that until he talks to you he doesn't actually know how you feel. Once you've made it clear he no longer has that excuse and then if he continues you really have just cause against him.
Sadly I speak somewhat from personal experience (except I was the one calling too much)...
I did have a long post half-written on this, but I can't say it better than Honeybee.
I've also been in similar situations. Worse still, when I did get hold of the person, they'd tell me that they weren't ignoring me, I'd believe them, and the cycle would repeat. After all, why would they say something that wasn't true?
You definitely need to be open and honest about this with the people, otherwise the fucked up situation will continue. You need to tell the guy that you made a drunken mistake, that you don't want to see him, and I would even tell him why (because he's been violent toward you and you can't deal with that). And I would tell your friends the rest of the details, just so they can understand the gravity of the situation and why you are so worried. Plus, you said that you and the guy share the same friends, so you need as much reinforcement and support as you can get, otherwise your ex can turn your friends against you. I doubt that your friends will blame you for what is happening. Yeah, it was dumb to sleep with him (you know this and you friends will think this), but you did not invite the stalking. Even non-feminists would surely see this.
That royally sucks. and its not your fault.
I had someone stalk me once. I called a domestic violence hotline. they advised a couple of things:
1. keep a detailed written log of every time he stalks you. every phone call, every text message, every email... if he were to start following you around in person, log every time he he does that too. record the date, time, mode of stalking (phone, email, in person, etc), and exactly what they did or said.
2. do not engage your stalker. don't answer their phone calls, don't respond to their text messages or emails. if you see them in person, try to calmly leave the situation without talking to them. they are doing this to intimidate you, and responding by telling them to go away is going to encourage them to keep doing it.
3. one exception - send them one, and only one message explicitly telling them to leave you the fuck alone. preferably, do this in a way that can be recorded such as an email. The reason for doing this is solely so that if you ever need to take legal action, you have evidence saying that you told him to leave you alone. be as explicit as you can. dont try to spare their feelings.
4. go ahead and file a report with the police. they probably won't do anything about it now. the main idea is that if you needed to take legal action later, you'd already have a history to show.
I don't know how well the police and legal system handles stalking in your area, so I would highly recommend calling a local domestic violence hotline to get their advice. They might have different advice then the ones I called had for me.
by the way, there's no reason you have to tell people you hooked up with this guy again. that's your own personal business and you don't have to share details with people just because HE decided to go nuts. although he may tell them.
NOT your fault at all! Don't even think that! I'm going to echo what a lot of the others have said and tell you to make one communication with him telling him in no uncertain terms that you are 100% not interested. I'm always giving people the benefit of the doubt, so I am inclined to think that he doesn't realize how creepy he's being (I've been there) and probably just wants some kind of response from you giving the whole thing closure. I know it's frightening to confront someone after you feel like you've "lead them on" (been there too) but it is absolutely necessary. Lots of people will not get the message from simple non-communication. Tell him you do not want him to contact you again and that you have absolutely no interest in seeing him ever. If he still doesn't get it and keeps harassing you, then go to the police about it. I think it's good that you've told some friends what's going on, make sure to keep them updated with wether it gets worse/better. I've had friends in similar situations as yours and it can be so nerve-wracking to not know what's going on. I hope everything works out well!
When he first started texting you that was the time to text back and tell him that you are simply not interested, it was a one time thing etc.
It's not your fault but I don't understand why you would sleep with a guy drunk or not and not give him some kind of explanation the next day. If the tables were turned I'm sure you'd be upset that he had sex with you then ignored you the next day.
Honestly I can remember back to being a late teen with my first live-in boyfriend and phoning hospitals etc if he was an hour late coming home in fear something happened to him. (I'm forty-something now and I know how ridiculous stalking like that behavior was).
He could be thinking a lot of things. If he's a paranoid as I was when I was young he might be thinking you've disappeared. He might be thinking that you were too drunk and you hate him.....He might be thinking that was the best night of his life.
So just text him and simply tell him what above posters have said in a nice way. He may be creepy dangerous guy but he just might be socially inept boy. Either way a gentle letting down can do nothing but help the situation.
Well, seeing as how the poster had a relationship with the guy and therefore knows him the best and she feels that he is dangerous I'm going to take her word for it. Throwing a chair at somebody's head is scary. I don't find the phone calls all that alarming except that they need to be taken in context with the fact that this guy threw a chair at her before and she feels that he is dangerous which leads me to believe that he probably is. I do agree that letting him know she is not interested in him and wants no further contact with him is probably a good idea.
like cicada said.... she's already pointed out that he's been violent in the past. that is the part that steps far beyond 'socially inept boy' into scary, possibly dangerous person.
i can totally see how saying she wants no further contact seems reasonable. but will his response be reasonable? i believe this is where her apprehension comes from.
Kave, maybe you didn't read my whole post or my follow-up posts but as others have said, I had a relationship with this guy for a long period of time. I know him well. He is not some socially inept boy. He is violent, angry, controlling and scary.
I made a huge mistake hooking up with him and letting him back into my life and I deeply regret it. I know if I was sober or even slightly sober it would not have happened.
Yes I have been in the position where I have hooked up with a guy and then never heard from him again. It sucked. I was hurt. Very hurt. But you know what I didn't do? Stalk and harrass him. Just because he hurt me or led me on or used me or whatever you want to call it does not give me the right to harrass him.
This is it. Right here. The next time you start to blame yourself, come back to this attitude right here. I'm seeing anger instead of self-blame. Others have given you really good tangible advice that I can't add to, but it looks here like you know the truth. It's not your fault he's harrassing you. I know it's hard to hang on to that sometimes.
You're working on safety issues right now and that is more important than anything else and it always goes first. Sort out the rest later.
It doesn't matter what he's thinking. At all. We should not concern ourselves one bit with his viewpoint since he is a past perpetrator of domestic violence. Even though Llevinso said he was never violent, many of the actions she described, past and present, do fall into the category of domestic violence. I'm glad she got out when she did before they escalated as they usually do.
All that matters now given these previous and current patterns is Llevinso being safe. That's it. Anything else is a derail from the real issue here.
Blockquote mess up. The top lines were the quote, indented lines my comment. Woops.
Thank you for pointing this out.
I just wanted to specify one thing. I said he was never violent during our actual relationship. Then he just yelled a lot. After we broke up is when he kicked the chair at my head. And yes, I definitely qualify that as violent.
Thanks everyone so far for the comments. They really are appreciated.
I plan on texting him tonight and I'm really nervous. I'm not going to call him because well, that's just too scary. He has this way of twisting my words around all the time.
I'm planning on saying something like "What happened was a mistake and when you called me over and over really creeped me out a lot. Please stop." But I'm not sure...
I'm worried that this will just spur him into to texting or calling me more (I know his personality and he does NOT let things go). Or at least texting me back to try to ask more questions and I really don't think I owe him any more explanation than that, nor do I want to go into it any further.
It was a mistake. It's done. Leave me alone.
It was a mistake. It's done. Leave me alone.
Good call. That's the right thing to text him and leave it alone if he texts you back.
But you chose to sleep with angry violent ex, drunk or not you are wiping up the remains of your own mistake. At some point you have to take responsibility for that, not a major I'm a bad person thing, but maybe a I shouldn't put myself into that situation again thing.
I don't understand why you keep on saying I have to take responsibility for my own mistake. In what sense are you referring to?
I'm not pregnant so no responsibilities there.
Everyone here keeps saying I'm not responsible for being harrassed and I'm not.
Did I do something stupid and sleep with an asshole? YES! Which I've already said about 500 times!
I'm going to fucking text the guy to leave me the hell alone.
It's like you're looking for me to say something here that I'm not saying. What is it?
>>
And thats the end of it, time to move on. That's taking responsibility, nothing more. As for sexual assault I know that is easy to say it wasn't my fault but do you really want to go down that path?
Taking responsibility for WHAT? She's not looking for people to make her feel better about sleeping with an ex that she didn't actually like all that much. Are you saying she's supposed to take responsibility for him calling her a half a dozen times a day? How is that any of her responsibility? Tons of people have ex-sex that they realize was a really stupid thing to do, and being phone-stalked is not a reasonably expected result of that. An awkward conversation where you say, "Uh, yeah, that ex-sex doesn't mean we're back together," sure. But not being creepily stalked by phone.
"But you chose to sleep with angry violent ex, drunk or not you are wiping up the remains of your own mistake. At some point you have to take responsibility for that, not a major I'm a bad person thing, but maybe a I shouldn't put myself into that situation again thing."
What The Fuck is up with the victim blaming?
Thank you Elana!
All of kave's posts have this subtle hint of victim blaming and it's driving me crazy. It's not overt so I was trying not to jump to conclusions and get too offended but come on.
And then this: "As for sexual assault I know that is easy to say it wasn't my fault but do you really want to go down that path?" What does that even mean? I am actually a rape survivor and I didn't "go down that path" because it was "easy." Far from it actually. It was and is incredibly difficult. I struggle with it everyday and this was something that happened in 2001. But you know why I "went down that path?" Because I was raped! Arg!
"It's not overt so I was trying not to jump to conclusions and get too offended but come on."
I think the vast majority of victim blaming isn't overt. If someone yells at a victim "ITS YOUR FAULT THAT YOU WERE [insert crime here]!!!!!!11!!1one" the victim is likely to recognize this abuse for what it is and not take the yeller seriously.
So instead they dress it up with nicer language. They tell you that maybe you shouldn't have done such and such. And then they have the audacity to say that they're telling you this stuff for your own protection.
*puke*
There is no victim here at the present time.
There could be, which is why she needs to protect herself in as many ways as possible from further contact.
But to attack me for victim blaming? Not relevant. She was not raped, she made a bad decision when drunk. Next time I have no doubt that drunk or not creepy violent ex's will not be invited into bed.
And yes Llevinso I would not text him unless he text's first again.
Calling this now a sexual assault is asinine and in my opinion further degrades women who have been raped. Waking up and regretting does not mean you were raped and I'm not going to pussyfoot around it.
I wasn't even referring to whether or not it was a sexual assault.
telling her that she is "wiping up the remains of her own mistake" by being stalked, and then telling her that she needs "to take responsibility for that", and that "maybe she shouldn't put herself into that situation again" is victim blaming, and its abusive.
and I'm not going to pussyfoot around it.
Banned. (Kave, multiple users pointed out your victim blaming - which isn't tolerated on the site.)
That seems a little harsh to me. As in terms of responsibility this is quite a complex scenario.
The way I read it, Kave is saying that the OP needs to take responsibility for the consequences of the sex on her ex NOT for his actions since.
It's a tough one yes, because the ex appears to have decided that her not treating him appropriately in this instance gives him the right to seek contact beyond what is reasonable (which isn't right), and if the OP does say something the majority of us seem to think he will stop.
I think what Kave is saying is that if you get involved with someone you have certain social responsibilities to their feelings. You do NOT have a responsibility for their actions, you are not to blame for them.
Most posters have been saying that if the OP fulfils her social responsibilities the ex will stop harassing her. That's not the same thing as saying that she deserves to be harassed for not doing it. Nor is it the same as saying that she caused the situation by her actions; he's caused the situation by his over-reaction to her non action. Different thing.
But see, this is the thing, I don't OWE him anything. Would the "polite" thing to do have been to return one of the 20 original calls he left for me? Maybe so. But it also would have been the "polite" thing for him not to phone stalk me. Just because I slept with him or talked to him or whatever does not mean I OWE him anything. We all had this same conversation last week when the girl was cursed out by a guy via text for not responding to his date proposal. She does not OWE him a response because she does not belong to him.
Technically he's the one that left that morning before I even awoke out of my drunken coma. He's the one that had sex with me while I was blackout drunk and he was stone-cold sober. Maybe maybe maybe he's so dumb he doesn't realize any of these things (is what you and kave appear to be saying). But neither of you actually know this guy. I dated him. I've known him for going on 11 years now. He's not stupid. He likes to control and intimidate people, especially women.
Yes, this whole thing was stupid and I messed up. I'm not putting all the blame for that night on him. I never said I was. But I'm also not going to go around saying it was completely my fault and I'm a horrible person for putting myself in that situation. I'm trying to clean it up as best I can and nothing is perfect. I'm scared and doing all that I can do within my emotional power. I am human, give me a fucking break. But what is completely his fault is this harrassment! That's on him!
"Most posters have been saying that if the OP fulfils her social responsibilities the ex will stop harassing her." Oh, and just so you know, I turned on my phone this morning and my inbox is full and I have four text messages, all of which I'm too scared to even read. I'm now thinking about changing my phone number. So much for the theory of him going away.
"Oh, and just so you know, I turned on my phone this morning and my inbox is full and I have four text messages, all of which I'm too scared to even read."
I'm sorry to hear that. I hope it works out for you.
"Would the "polite" thing to do have been to return one of the 20 original calls he left for me? Maybe so. But it also would have been the "polite" thing for him not to phone stalk me."
We agree on both those points.
Thank you.
And I'm sorry if I sounded so defensive. I was being defensive. It is difficult in these situations where you are writing about personal experiences (especially stuff that is still going on) and you are scared.
"Oh, and just so you know, I turned on my phone this morning and my inbox is full and I have four text messages, all of which I'm too scared to even read. I'm now thinking about changing my phone number. So much for the theory of him going away."
that sucks! what a fucking asshole. I wish I knew what more to say.
I'm sorry that he has continued to contact you.
However, I seriously think you need to read what he has written. They are just words on a screen. They cannot jump off and bite you. You won't even be pulled into an unwinnable, endless conversation. You don't have to answer his points, if he tries to make any. But you do need to know what he has written.
There is some very small chance they might just say "I have no idea what the last month was all about, but your message made it clear where you stand. I'm only contacting you this one last time to let you know that I intend to respect your wishes -- for the sake of closure, rather than leave you hanging. I will not bother you again. Signing off now."
It seems rather more likely that they say something like "WTF? You fucked me, and now you avoid me like the plague? What the hell is up with that?" In that case, don't get drawn into it. You can text one last time saying "I already explained. I mean it. Do not contact me again. I will regard further attempts as harrassment, and will involve the police."
On the other hand, if they are angry and threatening, you need to know that, so you can take appropriate next steps (such as going to the police immediately).
Refusing to read the messages is not in your best interest. Either he is being honorable, in which case you are safe, and needlessly torturing yourself -- or he is going to escalate, in which case you are depriving yourself of information necessary to protect yourself. But you won't know which it is until you read those messages.
Again, good luck with this.
"There is some very small chance they might just say "I have no idea what the last month was all about, but your message made it clear where you stand. I'm only contacting you this one last time to let you know that I intend to respect your wishes -- for the sake of closure, rather than leave you hanging. I will not bother you again. Signing off now."
It seems rather more likely that they say something like "WTF? You fucked me, and now you avoid me like the plague? What the hell is up with that?" In that case, don't get drawn into it. You can text one last time saying "I already explained. I mean it. Do not contact me again. I will regard further attempts as harrassment, and will involve the police.""
you might have a point if he had sent one message. but he sent four text messages and filled up her voice inbox.
this is not about him letting her know that he'll leave her alone.
she already texted him one last time. she should absolutely not text him again, because that's exactly what he's looking for. stalkers are trying to force attention from their victims. if they can't get positive attention, they will settle for negative attention. continuing to tell him to leave her alone will only reinforce his stalking behavior.
I agree that it would probably be in her best interest to read/listen to the messages so that she can log them, and take appropriate action.
but these messages are threatening in nature, and I don't think she should have to submit herself to them if she doesn't feel ready.
llevinso - do you have any friends who can listen/read these for you or with you?
"but these messages are threatening in nature, "
They are threatening in exactly one characteristic: the count. The contents are entirely unknown at this point. This is also the case with virtually everything he has sent thus far. Of the few voice mails that llevinso listened to, exactly one sounded angry. She was even freaked out by the ones that DIDN'T sound angry! And she assumed that the materials that she didn't listen to or read must have been angry.
"and I don't think she should have to submit herself to them if she doesn't feel ready."
The suggestion about getting a friend to read them is a good one.
When I said "You can text one last time saying "I already explained. I mean it. Do not contact me again. I will regard further attempts as harrassment, and will involve the police,"
I meant only do that if you hadn't said that in the previous email, and after that, do not respond any further to him. Sorry if that was unclear.
"[The messages] are threatening in exactly one characteristic: the count. The contents are entirely unknown at this point. This is also the case with virtually everything he has sent thus far. Of the few voice mails that llevinso listened to, exactly one sounded angry. She was even freaked out by the ones that DIDN'T sound angry! And she assumed that the materials that she didn't listen to or read must have been angry."
They are threatening for several reasons. The count is one of them, but there are several other reasons which I think are more important:
They are coming from someone who has a history of being manipulative and violent towards her.
They are coming from someone who thought it would be ok to have sex with her while she was blackout drunk. (I'll let her decide what to call it.)
He has continued sending them, even after she explicitly told him they are unwelcome.
Look, this guy has no sense of boundaries. He has been invasive and violent towards her before, and she has every reason to believe that he might be again. The messages are invasive in and of themselves because she has already told him to stop. Add it all together and these messages are extremely threatening.
To be clear, I'm not suggesting you continue to read or listen to everything he sends, or continue to tell him to bug off multiple times, if he doesn't go away here. Just this once, in case this is the end of it.
After that -- or right now, if his most recent texts were threatening -- ignore him, and go to the authorities.
First of all, I do plan on listening to the messages eventually only for the purpose of knowing if police action is needed. But now I'm too scared.
Secondly, I'm sorry you don't understand why I was scared by even innocuous sounding messages when there were 6 messages in a row on my voicemail after 20 calls. But I KNOW THIS GUY. Each message was him saying the same thing in the same creepy calm manner with a forced sounding smile on his shitty face as if to say "Why do you make me act in these crazy ways? How can you not be picking up the phone after I've called you 20 times in 3 days? I'm really a nice guy that just wants to bash your face in with a chair."
Third, how on EARTH could he just have been texting me back 4 times and filling up my ENTIRE INBOX just to say "Sorry, I didn't know you felt that way. This will be the end of it. Best regards!" That is one message tops.
"in terms of responsibility this is quite a complex scenario.
The way I read it, Kave is saying that the OP needs to take responsibility for the consequences of the sex on her ex NOT for his actions since...
...I think what Kave is saying is that if you get involved with someone you have certain social responsibilities to their feelings."
She is taking responsibility. She has taken steps to ensure that she won't get pregnant.
And now she is taking steps to protect herself from a manipulative and violent abuser who is stalking her.
Her responsibility is to herself. She doesn't need to explain herself to her abuser. She has zero social responsibilities to him or his feelings.
Don't be nice about this, even slightly. Don't say "please". That's a request. There is no request here, this is you telling him what to do- not contact you anymore.
You don't have to pull out the big gun- threats of a stalking report- right away. Text him with, essentially, "Sleeping with you was a mistake. If you think we can get back together, you're wrong. If you're harassing me for some other reason, you're psycho. Either way, stop calling me." Then give him three days or so- no more than a week. If he keeps after you consistently for that time- if it's not obvious, do not, under any circumstances, answer the phone or respond to him- text him again and say if he tries to contact you once more, you're going to the cops.
And if he does, go to the cops.
If you would prefer not to get the police involved- which, from what you've said, would be understandable- you have the option of asking a mutual friend to tell him you're not fucking around with this. It seems very likely if you threaten him with the police, he won't immediately back down just because he may not believe you'd do it. That's why it's important you live up to any threat you make, but if he gets word from another person that he should not misjudge your willingness to run him in, that makes it more likely he'll quit before you have to report him.
if he's harassment is slowing down, it might be better to not contact him at all. There is a very real possibility that the harassment might start escalating again when you contact him. again, I highly recommend calling a domestic violence line. the advice they give tends to be very practical.
if you do decide to contact him, there's no need to refer to what happened as your "mistake". and to be perfectly honest, your description of how drunk you were makes it sound more like a sexual assault than a mistake, but maybe I was misinterpreting you.
this document has a few verbage suggestions: http://www.ncvc.org/src/AGP.Net/Components/DocumentViewer/Download.aspxnz?DocumentID=45093
I'm not interesting in having a relationship with you. Do not continue to call, stop by, or have any contact with me whatsoever.
I want you to stop trying to contact me. If I discover that you have followed me, been on my property, or called my work or home, I will call the police and file stalking charges.
I am ending our relationship. Do not make any attempt to try and renew it. I will not change my mind. I do not wish to have any contact with you now or in the future. If you try to contact me, I will take legal action against you.
I will no longer tolerate this harassment. If you try to contact me in any shape or form, I will call the police.
"...your description of how drunk you were makes it sound more like a sexual assault than a mistake, but maybe I was misinterpreting you."
No, you're not misinterpreting. It's still a little too recent in my head for me to go there yet though, you know? I was almost blackout drunk though and he was completely sober. If someone else told me this story I'd say the same thing.
I was thinking of waiting until he contacted me again to send this text, then it wouldn't seem so out of the blue and maybe it wouldn't provoke him INTO contacting me (cause as I said before, I could really see that happening). The last time he called was on Saturday (two times within 5 minutes). I don't know...
But thank you Elana. Your comments have been extremely thoughtful and helpful.
Okay so, surprise surprise, just as I was leaving work today he called me (arg!). I didn't answer but just now when I got home I texted him as planned. It was scary and I admit I hesitated before sending it. But I sent the text! And then I quickly turned off my phone so any attempt made by him to call me back won't work. I am worried that when I turn it back on later I'll have several messages from him but there's nothing I can do about that. I do feel a bit relieved that I've sent the text, but now I'm also on edge.
Good luck.
good luck!
The fact that you have at long last given him a clear direction to stop trying to contact you is a good thing.
Giving him the benefit of the doubt, he may well have thought you were inviting him back into your life, and now he's completely confused by you fucking him and then dropping off the face of the earth. At least now he finally knows that the sex was a mistake, and his advances are entirely unwelcome. If he has the least bit of decency, the chances that your inbox won't be full when you turn your phone on again went up quite a bit when you sent that text.
Good luck.
I repeat the well wishes, and also might suggest not waiting too long to turn your phone back on. It's the not-knowing, the array of possibilities, that will drive you crazier than any of the actual outcomes (which, generally, are just: he bombs you with messages, he leaves a couple but appears to be giving up, or there's nothing).
good luck. i hope things are working out a little better now, that he takes the hint, and he's out of your life!
You're post resonates so much with me. I was harassed by a boy from when I was 17 until 19. When I was 14 I dated him for 2 weeks (one of those teenager "relationships" where two awkward teens say they are "going out" but barely even talk to each other). I had no idea he was going to turn into a creepy stalker.
When I was 17 I got a call from a number I didn't recognize. It was him asking me out. I flat out told him no, that I wasn't interested and would never be interested. He called again and again and again. I ignored these calls (some of them were at 2 in the morning which set off alarm bells for me) and I sent a text to him clearly stating "Do not contact me, I will not reply to anything". He carried on calling, texting and he even came over to my house. Luckily for me, my family moved when I was 18 and I got a new phone and number so I didn't hear anything from him for over a year. Then a friend told me he'd contacted her asking where I lived and where I worked (she didn't tell him). This was the last straw and I finally called the police. They told me "they knew all about him" but didn't explain further. They told me to keep records, including the text message that said not to contact me (it was still on my old phone although my number had been deactivated just so anyone is wondering how I still had the message). I'm pretty sure they went to talk to him because I didn't hear anything for 4 years until he sent me a facebook request. I promptly blocked him and any "mutual friends".
Anyway the reason I wanted to tell my story was the fact that I felt ashamed because I'd dated him at 14. It wasn't a relationship and I wasn't to know how he would turn out but when I tell people today, I leave out that part.
Reading your post made me feel better about admitting that I dated him. It's not my fault and I didn't deserve the fear I lived in.
I understand how you feel because I feared him too and he wasn't even physically threatening like the guy you're describing is.