The term "effortless perfection" was first coined by a student at Duke University (whose name, interestingly, I have been unable to find despite scouring the internet for it). You've probably heard of it before. Or, if not, you've probably thought it. It refers to the expectation that women fit our society's unrealistic and arbitrarily-defined standard of beauty and desirability without seeming to expend any effort to achieve it. (The conversation at Duke also included the concept of achieving academic perfection without trying too hard. It's a great topic and worthy of discussion, but I'll omit it in this particular post because the subject matter is already broad enough as it is. Plus it's less personally vent-worthy for me. Eh well.)
Most heterosexual men are consistent in their description of the kind of women they look for.They want a woman who's "real." Someone who's willing to be herself. They don't like it when women diet or worry about their weight. It's a turn-on when women can actually eat . And they'll all decry the superficiality of makeup, and express a preference for "natural" women.
At first glance, these all seem healthy, supportive, even pro-feminist. However, even a cursory glance below the surface of the expectations of these same men quickly exposes their blatant hypocrisy. Many heterosexual men (not all, but many) still prefer the tanned, groomed, photoshopped fantasy they are perpetually fed by the media. The men who talk about how they love when a woman doesn't diet or worry about her weight turn right around and fat-shame the women they deem unattractive. The men who decry the superficiality of make-up are nonetheless quick to judge (even "rate" or "rank") a woman's face, blissfully ignorant to the incredible difference well-applied makeup can make.
In short, many heterosexual men still expect women to fit their artificially constructed fantasy, as long as it is (as far as the men can tell, at least) authentic. As long as it's easy. They want a woman who is as beautiful as a celebrity without makeup, and as sexually adventurous as a porn character without violating her boundaries. They want a size 2 woman who eats burgers and doesn't diet. They like a relaxed woman, who can just lounge around in jeans and a comfy top, as long as it looks like this, not like this. (Yes, they're both Jessica Simpson.) They want a woman with large breasts, as long as she doesn't "fake it" with a push-up bra or surgery. They want a straight woman who can lie in bed, writhing in pleasure, belting "I kissed a girl and I liked it"" while the camera repeatedly zooms in on her breasts, legs, and tongue. After all, she said she likes it!!!
I remember watching a movie with a blatently misogynistic ex-boyfriend of mine (whose worldview was best encapsulated in his statement that "Men can't be promiscuous. They're just being men. It's only 'promiscuous' if a slutty woman does it") in which the main character had an affair. My then-boyfriend remarked about halfway through the movie that it's understandable that the man would cheat on his wife--after all, "the mistress is way hotter." I swallowed about a dozen criticisms of that statement. However, I couldn't resist pointing out the amount of eye makeup the mistress character wore. It would be impossible to tell whether her authentic face is beautiful or not. (Yes, I know that even my response was problematic, but sometimes you've got take baby steps with these guys.) He brushed it off, as though I were crazy. Later in the movie, "the mistress" was shown crying and not wearing any makeup. She was barely recognizable. Without the makeup, she didn't even look like the same person. He turned to me, totally aghast, and admitted that I had been right all along. Glad I could rock your world with the stunning revelation that makeup makes women prettier, asshole.
Another misogynistic ex-boyfriend of mine had one of his notorious "you really need to lighten up" moments when I was disgusted at the promotion of a "College Girls of..." calendar, featuring softcore pornographic pictures of students at the local university. He told me that there's nothing exploitive about the calendar, considering "those girls clearly like it." As though these women were spontaneously prancing around in bikinis and stilettos, posing suggestively and dreaming of the day some college dudes would come take their picture and sell it to other college dudes . Trust me, my attempts to explain performative sexuality and the male gaze to him fell on deaf ears.
In these ways, our sexuality, our faces, our bodies, and our whole personalities become nothing more than performances. And to limit the scope of this discussion to performance for heterosexual men cheapens the problem--we do the same with our teachers, our friends, and our parents. We play into every hurtful fantasy and double-standard, desperately hiding the evidence that it doesn't come naturally to us. Thousands of women are hiding food in napkins so no one realizes how little they're eating. Others are eating normally, but purging later when no one is watching. All of them insist they "just have a high metabolism, I guess." Some women are shopping for the most sexy and flattering outfits money can buy--to wear while they're working out, lounging around, cleaning, or sleeping. Some are learning for the first time that as long as you don't wear too much blush or too-bright lipstick, men will be entirely oblivious to the amount of makeup you're using to hide your "flaws" and reshape your features.
Admittedly, none of this is news to feminists. It remains, however, successfully hidden from the heterosexual men who demand this brand of "authenticity" so vehemently. How will they ever learn that authentic women come in all different shapes, sizes, and personalities when so many heterosexual women continue to impersonate Paris Hilton, Katy Perry, and Britney Spears (the early years)? How can we women ever stop this impression, when we know that giving up the act will cause us to be judged, dehumanized, and/or fat-shamed? Indeed, perhaps the toughest issue surrounding the myth of "effortless perfection" is the question of how to eradicate it.
Unfortunately, this is a question for which I do not have an answer. What do you think?
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Ok last *poll* they did said men want a woman who is a size 8 NOT a size 2. Those sizes are vastly different but chances are slim a woman who is a size 8 is in any way shape or form overweight unless a she has a lot of muscle weight or b) she's just really blessed to have an incredible shape despite being overweight. Dorothy Dandridge, Tyra Banks, Marilyn Monroe all extremely attractive/beautiful women were never smaller than a size 6. Yet MANY women will SWEAR none of them were ever bigger than a size 4 or 2.
I harp on that as a woman who has hovered between 6-10 most of my life and no more than a 14 pregnant and have been told by other women that I look anorexic. I'm too small. Even shortly after giving birth and being OBESE and a size 14 I was told I was "not big" huh?!? A size 14 being the average size doesn't make smaller sizes all of a sudden tiny.
There are women who look incredibly gorgeous without makeup on but that shouldn't make other women who aren't in the same boat feel bad about themselves. I've seen men who look like they have a mouth half full of yellow and black fangs and half full of of empty space, who sports a mean scowl almost 24/7 and looks like soap and water doesn't know him AT ALL. YET this man will not only think have standards so high for women that he would fail miserably to meet but have an incredible sense of self confidence. The Shamar Moores, Dwayne Johnsons, Brad Pitts, and Vin Diesels of the world don't affect his ego at all. WHY?
I think step 1 is just realizing that we are all different, our beauty will be different and beauty isn't everything (seriously realize the last point). Getting angry at not being told you're beautiful when YOU don't even first feel that you're beautiful is a hypocrit move. How can others see or notice your beauty when you don't see it yourself? Makeup isn't everything. Doing things to make your skin clearer and smoother can be a big difference. If you have dental PROBLEMS- not talking small imperfection here(lots of gaps, crooked teeth etc) that has altered the way you look, fix it if you can. Wear clothes that makes YOU attracted to
YOU.
I ADORE the Dove Beauty campaign.
The DOVE beauty campaign pisses me off. Its taking an anti stance as there marketing stance. They are still selling you crap! Am I the only person who sees this? Its like some real life Bill Hicks joke. We will market the anti marketing campaign to the people who marketing pisses off most so they will be pissed off and think were on their side and then buy our stuff cause we get it.
My feelings on the Dove campaign exactly. Plus don't forget Dove is owned by Unilever that also sells stuff like skin lightening products for women of color in asia.
They also own the Axe line of products for men.
Christ on a Cracker! I didn't know that. The "double pits to chesty" commercials make me want to push those guys off their bikes/skateboards.
As yes the 'you're perfect, you're gorgeous, now change' campaign. Still puts sales up 600% whenever it's on.
As yes the 'you're perfect, you're gorgeous, now change' campaign. Still puts sales up 600% whenever it's on.
Thank you for posting this. I have this discussion with friends, my partner and basically anyone who will listen, all of the time. I hadn't heard of the term 'effortless perfection' until now, but it it encapsulates exactly what I feel about this topic.
Women are expected to be everything and everyone. We are encouraged and expected to change our identities and persona according to the situation. Whatever the context calls for, we should be able to mold ourselves to adapt and succeed in that situation. Men want sass, but not too much to the point where we out wit the "guys." They want ambition and drive, but it has to walk that fine line, or else we're called bitchy and pushy. They want a sports fanatic, a keeper of the home, a sex kitten, a naturally beautiful woman who just wakes up and looks ready for the runway. They want us to not be concerned about what we eat, yet chastise us if we're "overweight."
I could go on and on, and you already touched on all of this. I just get so riled up about it.
Thanks again for sharing!
They want a woman with large breasts, as long as she doesn't "fake it" with a push-up bra or surgery.
I don't get this. Why exactly does it matter if the boobs contain mammary tissue, saline, or silicone? If they are the size that a guy finds attractive, why does he care what's in them?
As to push up bras, I don't think men really understand how even a non-padded bra changes the shape of a breast as compared to when they hang naturally. Guys who confuse the shape of a breast in a bra with the natural shape are bound to disappointed when it comes off (er, the bra, that is, not the breast).
Would you question the sensibility of a man who'd had penis enlargement surgery? Would you feel tempted to make any assumptions about his priorities and values?
Ha ha! Good point.
From what I hear, the problems many men have with fake breasts (whether saline or silicone) are:
1. They rarely look natural, especially when their owner is in the nude.
2. They don't feel like real breast tissue or move naturally during sex.
3. The fact that a woman got them in the first place makes her seem really insecure and shallow--not "girlfriend material."
Methinks #3 is especially pertinent to this article
Alyssa - and:
4. They make him wonder what else is fake - her nose, teeth, skin color, hair color...? What is she actually going to pass on to any kids?
I think one thing that might help is relaxed attitudes to casual nudity on TV and other places. That way more variety would be seen by frat boy types who otherwise only ever see porn stars until they are 20-something and finally get to see the real thing with any frequency, by which time their image is distorted.
That said I find this harsh on most men, the non fratboy ones. I've never dated a man who had the above beliefs. Indeed my husband made an interesting point. He'd told his friend (respectfully, sans specifics, and the friend is a personal trainer who I had discussed my exercise habits with) that I had the best figure of any woman he'd ever seen naked. I overheard and expressed pleased surprise. He said, "Well remember unless you go to nudist beaches or gyms with communal changing rooms, as a woman, you have actually quite possibly seen fewer non-airbrushed, sprayed, groomed, well-lit, carefully photographed, photoshopped naked women than I have, maybe even none at all." And he's right; besides myself I've only ever seen brief glimpses of naked adult women in the flesh. It never occurred to me he's seen more variety of unedited closeup female bodies than I have. So actually his point of comparison is far more real than mine.
I think this is partly why so many great guys truly don't get it when their perfectly attractive girlfriends say they have this or that flaw. The guys can't see the flaws and even if they could they know it's normal and they don't care. I think a lot of the article's concern, that men want women to be X or Y way, is actually in our heads, not theirs. I think it's (certain) women that want other women to aim for an impossible standard as a form of vicious rivalry. In my experience men are far more accepting and even worshipful of the raw female form. But maybe I am just lucky.
And women who get breast implants risk losing sensation in their nipples. A lot of men love playing with breasts, and I imagine some of that enjoyment is lessened if the woman isn't getting much pleasure out of it.
Nipples are an erogenous zone. Sacrificing an erogenous zone for fashion is just so very backwards. It's like a well frosted cake that's filled with Styrofoam so you can't eat it. I'll gladly take nipple sensitivity over breast size. While breasts can be very attractive and I appreciate that, they're not a big decision making factor for me in terms of relationship interest.
This is something I find kind of disturbing about breast implants. If a woman gets implants and looses sensation as a result, then she has pretty much turned her breasts into objects. I can't be the only one who thinks that is seriously creepy.
Uuuuh, not all women with natural breasts have sensitive nipples. Some have almost no “sensitivity”, or just don't like having their nipples played with. Some have far too MUCH sensitivity and don’t want their nipples played with.
That doesn’t suddenly make their breasts “just objects”.
We also have to consider that beauty is a considered valuable because it's RARE. Anyone can get implants, if they can afford them, but if you want true status, you have to get a real woman (aka women as objects to have value placed upon them by the male authority). Plus, yes, what's already been added, that if you've had (obvious) alterations to your body, people can treat you as shallow or whatever, because your beauty is not authentic.
Okay, so I see your point here, and you make a damn good one. However there's a couple of things that bothered me in your post:
Your statement "They want a woman who is as beautiful as a celebrity without makeup, and as sexually adventurous as a porn character without violating her boundaries. They want a size 2 woman who eats burgers and doesn't diet. They like a relaxed woman, who can just lounge around in jeans and a comfy top, as long as it looks like this, not like this. (Yes, they're both Jessica Simpson.) They want a woman with large breasts, as long as she doesn't "fake it" with a push-up bra or surgery." This tells me that you are speaking from one specific standpoint, which is a hetereosexual white male. It sounds like you are lumping everyone together. Different cultures subscribe to different beauty standards.
Let me make it clear, I dislike the unrealistic expectations or the notion of a perfect ideal in any setting/community, but I do think you need to consider the different variations in what different cultures/communities expect physically and personality wise from women. (I'm trying to make a point here, but I think it's coming out a bit jumbled, but I hope you understood what I meant.)
Also, I do think you need to give some men more credit. A lot of men are very aware of the stupid things we do to fit some kind of perfect mold. We're not fooling them by any means. My problem with some men though, is that they know we're doing all of this, yet, by being silent, or giving their approval, they are condoning it. There are some very enlightened men out there who don't care about mainstream beauty standards as well, I just feel like that number needs to be multiplied by, ohhh..a million.
To answer your question: "How can we women ever stop this impression, when we know that giving up the act will cause us to be judged, dehumanized, and/or fat-shamed?" . I think it's important to note that all women are not doing some of the things you mentioned in the article because of pressure from society or the patriarchy. I model, and have been in some men's magazines and sometimes what I do can be described as exploitive or anti-women. (I am one of those "calendar girls" that you spoke of.) I don't do it because I feel this pressure to be effortless perfection, I do it because I love being sexy, and I love modeling. For me it's simple. I do what makes me feel happy. I am concious of my decisions, and how they effect others.
When I feel as if though something that I am doing is not something I love, or is a result of pressure to attain a perfect standard, I stop doing it. I don't know if it will ever be eradicated. I do think that this standards would be on the way out of the door if society would let as a whole, on this whole achieving perfection in every aspect of your life idea. We have become a nation of superwomen and supermen, trying to achieve the impossible everyday, and this leads to very unrealistic ideals and beauty standards that we throw upon each other. Maybe if we more realistic, period, about our imperfections as humans, than we could see some change.
/Essay over (:
Thanks for the feedback. :)
For the record, I did make sure to specify that I was talking about most heterosexual men, not all men. However, your statement that my viewpoint encompasses primarily white men is a good one. Most of the men I have dated (the ones who tell me these things) have been white, with only 5 exceptions. For what it's worth, the man in the first anecdote was Iranian. But I definitely generalized, and I'll be more careful in the future.
Thank you for responding, I appreciate that. This post is something that we as feminists are familiar with already, as you stated, but it needs to be talked about again and again, and I'm glad you brought it up. Thank you for this.
Glad I could rock your world with the stunning revelation that makeup makes women prettier, asshole.
And I know you know this, but I want to point out: Makeup does not make women prettier. Makeup makes women conform more closely to a totally artificial appearance that marketing has slapped the label "pretty" on, then sold to the public.
some women actually use makeup to enhance what they already have ex women with dark eyes can use their make-up to make them even darker if they so wish. For me personally I like to use it to express my creativity, no different from any other accessory that I wear. I don't have to follow the cookie cutter mold that the media portrays with my makeup, but I can still enjoy it. Sometimes that irritates men, but for the most part I get overwhelming amount of praise for what I choose to do with it. I like expressing myself with my makeup, and I see nothing wrong with that.
Same here, I tend to go punk rock and will use bright colors and make bold lines with liquid eyeliner. I only wear eye makeup, too, I don't wear any foundation or blush or lipstick (ok, I've worn it a couple times recently.) I wish that make-up were less gendered and it was just something that anyone could wear any way they wanted.
I put on mascara once. It was an exercise in torture and removing it was nearly as unpleasant. I think men are lucky they aren't expected to practice that particular brand of masochism on a daily basis.
Thank you, I love this post. I get so mad at guys who go on and on about how how women take too long to get ready or care too much about how they look and then turn around and mock any woman they do not deem 'perfect.' Sorry, but those women you see in Maxim look like that because of professional hair dressers, make-up artists, and photoshoppers. And sometimes plastic surgeons and tanning beds.
Only thing... I am naturally a size 3/4. I don't diet and I eat a lot of fattening foods. I do have a fast metabolism. I know that's not the point of this post, I'm just saying, we are out there. That doesn't mean men should seek us out as the 'perfect' body type or expect that just because I am that all women can. : ) This means my breasts are small, a dammit, you can't demand a natural size 4 and a 38D cup!
I'm a natural size 4 and a 30DDD cup. We're out there! (And no bra-maker alive makes undergarments that fit us!)
Oh wow, I'm so sorry. Probably because it's not very common. But still! Just because people like you and me exist does not mean that we should be sought after as the ideal. Bodies come in all shapes and sizes, it's so limiting to seek the white size 4 32DDD with a perfect tan and bleach blond hair.
No offense taken, I know my body's not the norm. And that's fine, it's beautiful, and yours is beautiful, and everyone's is. Limiting your dating pool to the "ideal" is doing just that - limiting it. Often to an impossible extent.
A very personal aspect of this for me is that I am very small, usually between a size 2 or 3, with curves in the right places thanks to a Hispanic heritage. I eat junk food all the time and have a very high metabolism. Technically, my body does fit the ideal.
However, the other side of the coin from that Hispanic heritage of mine is how I will look once my metabolism slows down. I have grown up looking at women who are curvy and heavy, and I have always known that I will look like that as I get older. I realize that I can either fight it through diets and procedures, or embrace it now. I look at the women around me, my aunts and cousins, and I see them as far more beautiful than myself, mostly because of their personalities or smiles or fashion sense.
There is a certain amount of privilege that comes from having an "ideal" body, not just the increased objectification we are used to. I'm fortunate enough to know that my privilege has a time limit, so I can see it for what it is.
I hear ya girl - I'm a size 4ish and a 34DDD. And 5'2! (I'm a hodgepodge of body proportions. XD)
Yay! I'm 5'0 and a size 34 D and a size 4ish too!! It's nice to see the short big boobied girls speaking up.
I'm 5'2 too! *high five* Short big-breasted besties? ;)
I'm a size six and I also wear a 30DDD. I finally gave up and went and found the cheapest bras that were a DDD and took them to a tailor. She fixed them perfectly and my breasts have never felt better in a bra in my life. The cost was less than having to spend countless hours online to find a bra, and then having to pay upwards of $100 for one bra, when that is about what I paid for three.
I stopped wearing makeup a long time ago. At this point I believe I'm officially invisible :) I've also stopped dieting and get a lot less attention now (but I'm thankful for this, because I didn't like most of the men who would pay attention to me in the past anyway). Just yesterday I was working out on my stationary bike and some guy was staring at me with binoculars through the window (he was working on a rooftop across the road). I grabbed and jiggled my (considerable) belly fat up and down for a minute or so. He turned away and finally focused on his job. Asshole. I'm going to be real whether men like it or not. I'd rather be single and celibate then turn into a pretzel with no free time.
I mean, "than" turn into a pretzel...
I just have to say that you are a badass. :)
Great post!
You are absolutely right on. So many men want to date/marry/fuck a woman who takes no time or effort to be "beautiful," but don't realize that their version of beauty probably requires a GREAT DEAL of time, money and effort to keep together. (Or they realize it, but are okay with it so long as they don't have to see it. How gracious of them.)
I think the only way we can stop this is for all of us to be more honest. No more "I just have a fast metabolism!" conversations unless you actually do. No more "Look at how perfect this model/actress is!" without a list of the people making her up and photoshopping her. Men and women perpetuate all these lies together.
"I get so mad at guys who go on and on about how how women take too long to get ready or care too much about how they look and then turn around and mock any woman they do not deem 'perfect.'" - Lillith Luffles
"...version of beauty probably requires a GREAT DEAL of time, money and effort to keep together." - Kate
Though they seem small these strike me as supremely important things. I've been thinking about the question of resources for awhile, but I don't seem to be able to articulate the issue well, so I'm just jumping in now.
It seems to me that a lot of inequality comes from not just resource allocation (money, power, etc) but also resource use (which also includes time and energy, etc).
My experience is that I have finite energy, any given day, that I can spend how I choose. I also have a finite ability to really care, and invest in things. A finite amount of effort I can put into something. Finite time and money. But my choices about what to do with these resources aren't unaffected by the pressures put on me to perform my gender.
As an example, if we take a man and a woman (though I imagine we can extrapolate from here), of equal intellect, initial resources, and interest in X career, etc, and place them in a culture that demands a less realistic, and more unattainable beauty standard from women and applies more pressure to them, we should ultimately expect their relative achievements to differ with the man having an advantage. Attempting to perform that particular gender role just costs more time, money, energy, foresight, planning, thought, mindfulness. It seems small, but if, everyday, she can engage less in pleasurable activities, or she has to rush more, or she gets less sleep because of the different amounts of time it takes to get ready in the morning, or she has less time to relax, these things add up. Just a little more of resource Y can't be conjured up, there has to be a trade somewhere.
What bothers me is the way in which women will be over accommodating to please their mate. My girlfriend fights the tendency to absorb my likes and dislikes and make them her own, even though I tell her repeatedly that it isn't fair to her to do such a thing. Men are not nearly so inclined, I find.
This. It's a socialization process that takes eons (and lots of repetition and resolve) to overcome. We've been conditioned all our lives to take a backseat to the boys in our class, to the men at the cooler, to our boyfriends' preferences. To me it's like a "slavery" type reflex. I remember the first time I read The Captain's Daughter, by Pushkin: I was struck by how the house serf identified with his owner and wished to defend him from the "mob" of field serfs, and it reminded me of being a minority francophone woman in an anglophone environment expected to support the men in my ethnic group at all costs, even to my own life and career.
I might speculate that there's a selection effect at work here; women might, on average, find men who are "doormats" unattractive, so men who would have such tendency are much less likely to have a girlfriend to mimic, but I really don't want to start a flame war here. :(
I think it's more complicated than this.
As I understand is, men who are "doormats" get girlfriends just fine; the problem (so I hear) is that the relationship can be rocky because his partner doesn't respect his boundaries and he feels like he is not "leading" the relationship.
(This is not my lingo, but theirs)
But I think societally a man being a "doormat" has now become synonymous with this sort of "feminization" of the modern male, so it's getting a lot of attention in terms of self-help, how to fix your marriage, how to attract better quality partners, etc.
I don't necessarily agree with all of it, especially the once again dig at femininity; but I think it's a positive message in general for people to set strong boundaries and stay true to themselves, male or female.
And, of course, the "feminization of the modern male" just means, in reality-speak, the "profound improvement men experience in their daily lives when they start treating women like people, with individual wishes, thoughts, and desires" :)
Agreed. Unilever is also the owner of Axe products, which uses blatantly misogynistic and exploitative ad campaigns.
Also, I think it's the biggest scam that Dove is trying to use "self-esteem" to sell cellulite cream. Ugh.
I think one thing that might help is relaxed attitudes to casual nudity on TV and other places. That way more variety would be seen by frat boy types who otherwise only ever see porn stars until they are 20-something and finally get to see the real thing with any frequency, by which time their image is distorted.
That said I find the article harsh on most men, the non fratboy ones. I've never dated a man who had the above beliefs. Indeed my husband made an interesting point. He'd told his friend (respectfully, sans specifics, and the friend is a personal trainer who I had discussed my exercise habits with) that I had the best figure of any woman he'd ever seen naked. I overheard and expressed pleased surprise. He said, "Well remember unless you go to nudist beaches or gyms with communal changing rooms, as a woman, you have actually quite possibly seen fewer non-airbrushed, sprayed, groomed, well-lit, carefully photographed, photoshopped naked women than I have, maybe even none at all." And he's right; besides myself I've only ever seen brief glimpses of naked adult women in the flesh. It never occurred to me he's seen more variety of unedited closeup female bodies than I have. So actually his point of comparison is far more real than mine.
I think this is partly why so many great guys truly don't get it when their perfectly attractive girlfriends say they have this or that flaw. The guys can't see the flaws and even if they could they know it's normal and they don't care. I think a lot of the article's concern, that men want women to be X or Y way, is actually in our heads, not theirs. I think it's (certain) women that want other women to aim for an impossible standard as a form of vicious rivalry. In my experience men are far more accepting and even worshipful of the raw female form. But maybe I am just lucky.
(This was meant to go down here so Feministing please delete the reply version where I accidentally posted above)
I liked this post. There were a lot of good points made. However I definitely agree that, there are those women out there who are naturally pretty, and naturally thin. I am not trying to gloat or anything when I say that I fall into this category. Trust me, I've felt that A LOT of the time it can actually be a curse. I was eaten alive in middle school by my girl"friends" because they were jealous of me. The boys liked me and thought I was "cute". I did not understand this at first, I didn't understand why the girls who i thought were my friends would be so cruel to me. It was really difficult. I felt extremely alone. I have felt almost like i need to APOLOGIZE at times for being born this way. Which is absurd!!! I have felt in my life very hesitant to befriend girls at times in fear that they will get jealous of me.
Life is not always fair, but true beauty really does come from inside. In the end, personality holds up better than looks. Being considered "effortlessly perfect" is not always as great as it may seem. AND if ANY guy or girl is worth your time AT ALL, they will understand all of this. I know this may sound cliche, but really.
People too often do not take the time to do things that make themselves happy, rather than trying to please others. If you feel that you can only be happy if you're pretty, I'm sorry but you have some major reevaluating to do. Don't give in to the ridiculous standards patriarchy has set for women. They are RIDICULOUS.
Just for the sake of clarifying and adding to what I last said: I don't feel as though I elaborated enough. Also, I may be repeating what some others have already said. Basically, patriarchy sets unreasonable and really stupid standards for what women should be. (As well as men, they have to be masculine and tough etc.) This is pretty obvious, we all know this. So many women and men sadly buy into this. I'm going to focus on women for this one though. Every woman and girl is always striving to be the prettiest. This causes a lot of unnecessary rivalry between women. Slut bashing ensues, and all too often women don't see that they are not helping each other by name calling and what not, they are feeding the double standard, doing exactly what patriarchy wants them to.
If a woman's outside appearance is not what the media says it should be, it somehow becomes a comparison to their insides, or deems them "lesser" or not worthy or some bullshit. It is obviously a really tough situation to shake, since this idea has been so ingrained into society. Everyone wants to be beautiful. However, being so does not equate "better" life experiences, or being better in general.
Often these "effortlessly perfect" women, wether they strive to be so or not, have to deal with a lot of shit. Girls who are considered "pretty" and what not, often experience a lot more in-thier-face sexism. The respect factor goes right out the window. All women obviously experience sexism, that's a given. However, if you are what society refers to as an "ideal", things can also get shitty.
Everyone has heard of those stories or experienced "mean girls", and rivalry between women. Too many men feel as though they are entitled to talk to pretty women, say derogatory things, physically invade their bubble, all very forcefully at times. Men will often refer to women as "darling". "honey", "sweetie", etc. (gag). (NOT SAYING ALL MEN, definitely not all men)
There are a lot of assumptions that tend to be made, just by looking at these women, without even knowing what their personality is like. More times than not, attractive women are not taken seriously. If you're pretty, you're not smart. If you're pretty, you're a slut. If you're pretty, you're a snob. If you're pretty, you're life is easy. If you're pretty, you have money. And so on. Some of the same can be said for women with big boobs, or a nice figure etc.
Then there are also those times where "pretty" people get the unfair advantage, like getting a job over someone else. Like I said, these are really hard biases to shake, but if people can realize what is going on and why, and acknowledge it, and speak up, that's one step closer toward making things better for yourself, and others around you.
Those who are going to judge you, if you don't look "effortlessly perfect" are not smart, and should not be in your life. If they are total strangers, why do they matter? I would rather be liked for who I am, what I care about, what I like, and what I think, rather than the way I look. More often than not, people will be remember others for what kind of person they were and what they did, rather than how they looked.
“Be Who You Are and Say What You Feel Because Those Who Mind Don't Matter and Those Who Matter Don't Mind.” - Dr. Suess
(that quote may seem childish and "easy for me to say", and I know life can be way more complicated, but it's SO TRUTHFUL. REALLY.)
"If they are total strangers, why do they matter? "
Because they are the people who are sitting across from you when you go to a job interview. They are mentors or coaches or people who have an "in" to a world you want to be a part of, and are looking for a protege. They are the bank manager who will decide whether you get a loan or not. All of these are strangers on whom your livelihood depends, and if you don't make a good first impression, the competition will stomp on you until you are a fine dust on their shoes.
Friendship is not a zero-sum game, but career opportunities are. There are many, many occasions in life when your livelihood will depend on the good opinion of a stranger, and if they think favourably of you before you open your mouth, you will have an edge over others that might make the difference between dying in the gutter and prospering in a mansion.
I see your point, I guess I was more so referring to the strangers we all come across on the street or in random everyday places.
However, I don't think that a good first impression always lies solely in one's appearance. Yes, the first time you look at someone, it is human nature to size them up. However, personality and the way one carries themselves, can overpower physical appearance.
For example, someone at FIRST glance could be the most attractive person you have ever seen, but after you spend a few minutes around them, you find their personality repulsive and they become less attractive, and vice versa.
So yes, I agree that appearance is the first thing people see and it can often have an impact when it comes to career opportunities and such, but there is room for redemption; it does not automatically equal death in a gutter.
I'd like to raise a couple of points that haven't been mentioned yet.
First of all, it is usually only YOUNG women who can pull off this "effortless perfection" bit (but certainly not all young women). Any woman over the age of 25 or so usually has to work at achieving the societal definition of beauty. The subtext of effortless perfection is that men want young women.
Second, they want women who seem to put no effort into their looks and who eat. Again, these men just don't want to be bothered by a woman taking too long to get ready to go somewhere. They also don't want to eat alone or give up going to restaurants that have high calorie foods.
Men are not bothered by women putting effort into their appearance IF they don't know about it or they aren't inconvenienced by it. Men expected women to be without body/facial hair, have pretty hands and feet, and have naturally flawless skin. This entails waxing, manicures, pedicures, facials, trips to the dermatologists etc. Also, some women may eat heartily with their men knowing that she'll have to skip a meal later in order not to gain weight.
This is all about men having a woman who APPEARS to put no effort into her appearance. It's not about the reality of how her perfection is achieved!
Another misogynistic ex-boyfriend of mine had one of his notorious "you really need to lighten up" moments when I was disgusted at the promotion of a "College Girls of..." calendar, featuring softcore pornographic pictures of students at the local university.
I hate these. Every year when I was in school they'd be handed out in the commons areas and every year I'd see more than a couple of male professors pick them up and look at them. THESE ARE YOUR STUDENTS! Good god, you're a professor, have some class.
Now if the magazine was fill with pictures of the College boys of the athletic team with softcore porno... and a female professor would have look at them and say the same thing would you have been discussed be honest what would be your reaction
What if both male and female were pictured in the same magazine?
Yes, I would feel the same way for both sexes. It's inappropriate for a professor or teacher to openly sexualize students (males or female), even if they are legal adults. The professor/teacher is in a position of power and often writes letters of recommendations or serves as a guidance for the students. So it is very disturbing to me to watch these professors openly pick up these calendars and then openly look at them in front of students.
Is was not for me to question your honesty
my mistake
Ok, while I agree, there are guys out there that want women to always be fabulous, some of the harshest critics of women and the way they look are women themselves!!! Where I work, I women bashing other women for their choice in style or clothing. I here this far more from women than I do men.
I also could add that men simply don't spend their
time as much on appearances women will detect these inappropriate comments because its their choice to give them importance I don't believe all men intend for women to be perfect and our remarks are not necessarily directed at you or for you to be self conscious women are as much of an accomplice for the pressure of being perfect. Give some of the guys a bit of credit I have fell awe at the beauty of women
it is in the glowing smile in their eyes, the loud laughter, the tenderness in the voice that is what I find "Effortless Perfection"
the one thing that i want to add to the comments here is that this sort of thinking often goes away as men get older. i have no idea how many men actually think this way, though i've certainly encountered them, but i'd like to give them more credit.
yanno, i find this sort of fantasy about what your sexual/romantic partner will be is actually a rather normal part of growing up. many young women and girls have a similar fantasy about the kind of car their man will drive and what sort of house they'll live in and how he'll bring her flowers every night, etc. eventually, as we grow, and our bodies begin to disappoint us, and we come to meet people who we care about and realize they aren't perfect....this sort of thinking DOES go away, or at least is relegated to the realm of fantasy where it belongs, the part of my brain that dreams about having a full-time housekeeping crew in my house.
i agree that this "effortless perfection" ideal is real, but i think it's a sign of naivete, and one that eventually goes away as we all become more experienced at interacting with more people.
Slightly off topic... Seriously I don't think I've ever in my life, fantasized about what kind of car a future lover might drive, or house he might live in. Nor do I recollect ever having a conversation with friends about what kind of car we want a boyfriend to have. (You do have me on the flowers though, I'm certain there was a time I dreamed of getting flowers.)
I don't think these compare to the topic of this post. The OP is talking about how women are fed mixed messages, be pretty but don't try to be pretty. And about how men perpetuate those mixed messages "you don't need makeup/you look tired today". How does the comparison of shallow women who want a man to drive a BMW and then realize that there are more important things in life?
it's not an exact analog, but i've definitely known women who dream about a spouse who makes a lot of money, but who can take off from work to travel at a moment's notice, or spend a lot of money on relative frivolities. but, of course, people with a lot of money usually HAVE that money because they don't spend it on jewelry or designer clothes, and they work a lot.
in reality, it doesn't matter, in my view, about the exact nature of the fantasy. kinder, wiser people understand earlier that other people aren't perfect, and don't exist to fulfill other people's baseless dreams. i think most men DO come to realize this about women, and this "effortless perfection" fantasy eventually becomes replaced by (less exciting, but more rewarding) reality.
ever heard that expression, "love is, when you're puking, the one who holds your hair back"? i like it.
"... i've definitely known women who dream about a spouse who makes a lot of money, but who can take off from work to travel at a moment's notice, or spend a lot of money on relative frivolities. but, of course, people with a lot of money usually HAVE that money because they don't spend it on jewelry or designer clothes, and they work a lot."
Very good point. There is a perfect example of this on a reality TV show about plastic surgeons and their families-Yes it is as bad as it sounds. The flamboyant surgeons (thats how I remember him) wife has those same delusions. She wanted a big multi-million dollar house. To afford it Dr Flamboyant works his ass off. She then complains that he is never home. Then she goes and tries to buy an even bigger more expensive house. Some people need to get in touch with reality.
I know everyone is latching on to your points about beauty, but I thought this was equally spot on: "and as sexually adventurous as a porn character without violating her boundaries"
That is almost more prevalent than the beauty thing at my liberal New England college.
Also, I at least somewhat question the girls saying they had trouble making friends because of how pretty they were. I know plenty of gorgeous girls who have plenty of friends, but it's because they're outgoing very nice people. Some of us had trouble making friends in middle school because the popular consensus at school was that we were ugly. Middle school is tough for everyone dude.
Yeah, after I posted my comment I realized it didn't come off exactly how i wanted it to. I know middle school can be tough for everyone, obviously. It's not that I had "trouble making friends". I did have friends, I've actually always had a very easy time making friends. As far as my middle school experience, it was an extremely small rural school, I was ganged up on by a certain large group of girls, not by every girl. But because it was so small, it made it that much more difficult.
I guess my point was just simply that being considered "pretty" doesn't always make life easier, it can make it harder in a lot of ways. Everyone wants to be "pretty". Society seems to have this idea that being "pretty" equates to having everything and having an easy life or something. Just sayin', not always the case.
"Performative sexuality." That's another one for my feminist vocabulary.
I think we no longer have any objective basis for our standards of beauty anymore. Men say they want a "real" girl, and I think they're sincere in that, they've been enculturated to believe that what they see in the music video or on the cover of a magazine or in movies is "real." I think lots of popular culture perpetuates the 'effortless beauty' idea. How many times in a movie or TV show does the female lead wake up in the morning with perfectly tousled hair and expertly applied make up? SHE didn't have to spend three hours getting ready, she just wakes up hot. Men see the latest Hollywood bombshell on the cover of Vogue or Glamour and are told "this is what you want in a woman." They don't see that it took a team of 5 people 4 hours to do hair, make up and wardrobe, then another few hours with a professional photography crew and finally a little Photoshop Helper in post production. Men receive LOTS of messages about what a supposedly "real" woman looks like; is it any wonder they mistake a slick 5th Avenue advert for Real Life? In addition to getting the message that what they really want in life is the cover girl from Cosmo, they're also getting the message that girls like this actually exist and, most importantly, they *deserve* someone like that. Then, when men actually go out in the world to find that special someone, on a deep level they're disappointed and confused that so precious few women (if any, really) come even close to what they've accepted as their "standard of beauty."
It would be nice if this confusion and disappointment led to a re-examination of some of the cultural mores they'd accepted, and maybe to the realization they've been sold a bill of goods. Alas, however, along with these messages about what "real beauty" is they've also been given pretty explicit instructions on how to treat people who don't live up to their impossible standards: contempt, derision, ridicule, violence.
This is not to absolve anyone of the consequences of their actions, from the marketers who create the lie to the men who swallow it uncritically, but to illustrate that the notion of "effortless perfection" has deep roots in our culture; I suspect it will be a tough weed to eradicate.
Some of you need to put down those women's magazines and stop listening to reality shows for anyone to think that most men expect to find girls like on TV you sure don't give them much credit. There is a minority group that are very narcissistic male and female you see them on reality shows and this gives an impression that this is what the men dream of but what is funny its the women who are the majority of the viewers not the men they are not attracted to faces that is modified by "Botox" or other modifications where do you get all these ideas I can count on one hand the number of men who preferred this type of girls I felt sorry for them but what was amazing and I say this is because its so common of men I met what that the strongest attraction men will have for a girl is the way she will make him feel so I would be hard for a guy to feel right if he suspect that his girlfriend thinks he is superficial.
I agree with you in some ways. We use the magazine ideal as an example, but we all should all know that it's exaggerated and give guys some credit for not expecting that kind of perfection. But that doesn't make the OP's point less valid. Maybe we're not expected to look like Tyra Banks every morning, but we are expected to put a great deal of effort in and to pretend that that effort doesn't exist. Every boyfriend I've ever had and most of my guy friends very genuinely will say things like "you don't need makeup" and they do mean it! But then, society treats women drastically differently based on simple things like eye liner. That might be hard to believe, but it's absolutely true.
1- Men do not desire rail thin models and the vast majority recognize these models are unrealistic. But there's a middle ground between overweight and anorexic. Men are certainly willing to accept and probably prefer women who are a little more realistically proportioned- but this also does not mean that men want women who are obese. I'm sorry, you can bleat about acceptance and fat-shaming all you want, but your average (young) man will not date a fat women because they are unattractive.
2- Men generally prefer natural look to makeup, and that's where you get that data. However, to put it bluntly, if you aren't attractive naturally you should put on makeup. You're at a "disadvantage", I guess, but that;s just the roll of the dice. Some women are naturally pretty and others aren't. It's the same with men.
3- Men aren't attracted to ugly women. Sorry. The reverse is true too, obviously. You're looking at this the wrong way. It's a huge turn on when a woman can appear casual and still look good- *but not all women can do this, certainly not all the time*. And if you can't, well, that's just unfortunate. Put some effort into it. It doesn't make you unattractive or kill any chance you have romantically, it's just one turn on that you do not possess.
I concur that some of you need to put down the TV remote and go outside. This posts come across as though you're judging men based on MTV reality shows or something.
Thank you for proving my point.
Elaborate. I'm being truthful.
No, you are not being truthful. You're generalizing all men because of your OWN opinions.
If I said "Most men are dimwitted, perverted fools who can't take no for an answer and can't find their way out of a paper bag" because of my past dating experience, would that be the truth about men? Perhaps you're being truthful about yourself, but don't make all men out to all be as shallow as you.
You said:
"Men do not desire rail thin models and the vast majority recognize these models are unrealistic. But there's a middle ground between overweight and anorexic"
Absolutely. The middle ground is pretty vast. The average size 2 or 4 woman (not that size 2 or 4 is "average," just non-models who wear clothes in those sizes are A LOT bigger than rail thin models. That doesn't mean that fitting into a size 2 or 4 is realistic for the vast majority of women without perpetually dieting.
You said:
"Men are certainly willing to accept and probably prefer women who are a little more realistically proportioned- but this also does not mean that men want women who are obese."
Ah, but look at the women our society considers more "realistically proportioned." They are, at the MOST, size 6. They probably still weigh 40-50 pounds more than a model of their same height and build would, but they're still below average. By a lot, actually. I don't know you, so I don't know for sure whether or not you expect what society tells you to expect in that area, but from what you've posted it certainly sounds like you do.
You said:
"your average (young) man will not date a fat women because they are unattractive."
Read my original post again. This is EXACTLY the attitude I'm talking about.
You said:
"Men generally prefer natural look to makeup, and that's where you get that data."
Actually, at least with the men in my acquaintance, they are unable to distinguish "natural" makeup from "unnatural." Even the ones who brag about being experts at telling how much makeup a woman is wearing. They simply can't tell. They can look at a woman with smoky eyes and neutral lipstick, and honestly believe she isn't wearing much makeup. Without having applied makeup yourself several hundreds of times, without knowing all the "tips" and "tricks" that are thrown at women (whether or not they seek them out) from puberty on, most men simply don't have the background/knowledge to be able to tell how "natural" a woman's makeup is.
You said:
"However, to put it bluntly, if you aren't attractive naturally you should put on makeup. You're at a "disadvantage", I guess, but that;s just the roll of the dice. Some women are naturally pretty and others aren't. It's the same with men."
Read that again. Really. Read it.
It is NOT the same with men. Why? Because men aren't expected to wear make-up. Yes, I know that men have body image issues as well, and I'm not trying to minimize what you (or your male friends) have gone through questioning your appearance. That doesn't change the fact, however, that the standards for men in our society are much, much lower. If they were higher, men would wear make up too. The image of "beautiful" our society has created is absolutely unachievable for 99% of women without makeup. Now read your statement again. See how silly it sounds
You said:
"Men aren't attracted to ugly women. Sorry. The reverse is true too, obviously."
By "the reverse," do you mean that women aren't attracted to "ugly" men? That is absolutely not true. First of all, the "standard of attractiveness" (for lack of a better term) for men is so very broad that it is nearly impossible for a man in our society to be "ugly." Second of all, for the sake of argument, even if there are men our society defines as ugly, YES some women are attracted to them. And while we're at it, YES, some men are attracted to women you'd define as "ugly."
You said:
"It's a huge turn on when a woman can appear casual and still look good- *but not all women can do this, certainly not all the time*"
Yes. Exactly the point of my article.
You said:
"And if you can't, well, that's just unfortunate. Put some effort into it."
I wonder if anyone has ever given this advice to a man?
You said:
"I concur that some of you need to put down the TV remote and go outside. This posts come across as though you're judging men based on MTV reality shows or something."
I can't speak for anyone else, but my information comes directly from men. Perhaps they're the ones who should put down the TV remotes.
""And if you can't, well, that's just unfortunate. Put some effort into it.""
"I wonder if anyone has ever given this advice to a man?"
To be fair, yes. But it's typically to the extent that they should maybe shower and comb/cut their hair. Possibly they ought to acquire clothes that aren't several years old and fit them properly. Which is exactly your point about the very different quality and magnitude of standards, anyways.
Melissa - and men used to wear makeup anyway that was FAR from natural looking. And wigs, and elaborate clothes. It's a varying societal standard. The plain dark suit was not de rigeur until Beau Brummel made it so: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beau_Brummell Before that a bit of male creativity and flair in dressing, peacockry if you will, was common and encouraged.
In ancient Greek society male bodies were obsessively discussed and ideal beauty standards mooted (eg Narcissus). Perhaps because they were so accepting and even promoting of homosexual encounters (not that they thought this made you 'gay', they didn't believe in gay/straight, you just slept with who you slept with)? Indeed my gay male friends seem to be under just as much pressure as women to look a certain way.
I guess Mike is lucky to live in a time when the pressure on straight men is uniquely low.
"I'm sorry, you can bleat about acceptance and fat-shaming all you want, but your average (young) man will not date a fat women because they are unattractive."
Unattractive to whom? I hope you're saying unattractive to those men in particular, and not in general, because if so allow me retort with a WTF.
"Men aren't attracted to ugly women. Sorry."
Oh God, now I think I want to puke on my keyboard. Guess what? It's never good to generalize by saying "men prefer" or "women prefer". There's some not-so-shallow men out there that see beauty as being something inside, not outside. Unfortunately, they're usually taken...
Seriously though, would you mind taking your shallow stuff elsewhere? This is a community of women that realize all of us are different and beautiful, and by you saying SORRY UGLY CHICKS MEN JUST AREN'T INTERESTED you're going to make more women than myself rage and feel ill at the same time.
I wish more good guys like Comrade Kevin spoke up, because so far it's people like you and Scott that don't know how to do anything but put women down and act superficial.
All right, I shouldn't have generalized. The vast, vast majority of men under 25 will be *extremely prejudiced* against dating a fat woman because they are not attractive. That doesn't make them bad people, it makes them production of fucking hormones, dumbass.
Oh, and BTW, there are plenty of men interested in ugly chicks. Of course, they are usually ugly too. I'm being facetious. But seriously. While there are exceptions to every rule, women who are physically unattractive will have a harder time finding a man who is interested. It's pretty goddamn simple. There exist certain remedies- of which makeup is one- that can serve to make a woman more attractive, and they are available if one wishes.
Again, I'm sorry if biology "make you want to puke", but that's how it is. Deal with it.
I need to stop replying to trolls.
You're the same person that said the pay wage gap between men and women is a myth, after all, along with numerous other comments, so I suppose I can't expect credible answers from you.
Canlord2, your tone (not to mention your blatantly sexist content) is getting on everyone's last nerve and not producing real dialogue. I suggest you either get lost or cut it out asap.
I am not attracted to fat men. In fact I am not attracted to men unless they are fairly athletic. Does that make me shallow?
If surface is all you've got to go on, then making a decision based on surface is fine.
But when you can weigh personality, character, and all the other things that we *do* have control over, but you still make your decision based on surface-level stuff that we can't control, well, yeah, that's shallow.
Yes. You're shallow, I'm shallow, everyone's shallow.
I think there's a difference between people each having a set of standards, and having society set one big stupid standard for everyone. Eg., if some women like athletic guys, some women like skinny guys, and some women like big guys, then I don't think there's anything wrong with that. But what if all women were taught, by the media, peers, etc., that only athletic guys were attractive? What if women who had different preferences were shamed for having a skinny or chubby bf, and all the men who weren't athletic had horrible self-esteem because their dating prospects and societal worth hinged on their appearances? And if the men who fit the standard to a tee would be slobbered over and harassed by women looking for a trophy? So yeah, there's a difference between saying "nobody is attracted to fat people", and "I am not attracted to fat people". The first one is not only untrue, but very hurtful imo.
This. Exactly.
This posts come across as though you're judging men based on MTV reality shows or something.
Actually it economics really. You can tell a lot about what men really think and want by looking at their consumer habits.
Men often say (or complain) that they pay for sex one way or another; so it should come as no surprise that men as a group spend A LOT of money on sex and things related to sex. Look it up, google will point the way. And I'm not just talking about porn, but everything...strippers, sex workers, sex travel, phone sex, other activities legal and illegal.
I'm inclined to believe that this is not only the driver of women's excessive consumption on products designed to make women more sexually appealing, but this demand sets upper and lower limits on the intrinsic value female labor, which in turn affects a whole bunch of other decisions that women make in life.
So you see, women pay for sex as well. This is how we pay for it.
The part of your whole post that exemplifies what the OP is talking about: "Put some effort into it." The amount of "effort" that it takes women to be considered attractive versus what it takes men to be considered attractive is HUGE. Especially when it comes to things like trying to overcome your own genetic makeup, which men never have to do but women are expected to.
Thank you for proving my point.
Interesting. I think that a lot of men are secretly bitter and resentful about the fact that their girlfriends/wives will never live up to Megan Fox or Jessica Alba. That's when they cheat, when they look at tons of porn but still say that they think their girlfriend is beautiful. Subconsciously or consciously who knows, they wonder why they can't have a girl like Ms. Fox or Alba, but they would never say that to anyone because they know it sounds ridiculous. They look at Maxim because it's where the beautiful women are, when in reality, a lot of women could look like that with the right team of people helping.
I also think that the old ideas of the woman on the pedestal lead to very unrealistic expectations for what men should want in a mate. Our entire cultural history consists of stories (either fictional or exaggerated to the point of becoming fictional) of men who will do anything for the woman who is entirely "perfect" for them...I'm talking all the way from Helen of Troy to John Lennon and Yoko Ono. Heck, the rhetoric's starting to spring up around the Obamas, too. In reality, no one is that perfect, and no one is worthy of the "worship" that men are told they should bestow upon the ONE woman who IS worthy. Women, in contrast, are never taught to expect the metaphorical "face that launched a thousand ships." Men are taught that the perfect woman not only by the images they are shown, but through stories and rhetoric, that their very own modern-day Helen exists. How are we mere mortals ever supposed to compete?
Boy, I sure do like writing run-on sentences and forgetting the beginning of the sentence before I reach the end!
That was supposed to say "Men are taught not only by the images they are shown, but also through stories and rhetoric, not only that their very own modern-day Helen exists, but that life is incomplete without her."
(Ha. There. Slightly more coherent run-on sentence.)
Yes these are the men who later on, when they are 50 and all 22-year-old women look like Helen of Troy to them, go and exploit young hookers.
That said I still think the article is a bit too harsh on men. I do think these horrible men are a minority. I read some comprehensive studies about it and they say 10-15% of American men ever visit a prostitute (which is a LIFETIME stat, only about 6% go more than once). Given how impossible getting a beautiful or young partner is to most older men (the non-billionaires) that suggests they are actually happier to be with a less beautiful (or, not conventionally beautiful) or older woman than we may give them credit for.
I agree with pretty much everything in this essay, but the manner in which this societal phenomenom is laid (almost) solely at the feet of men doesn't sit well with me. (I know this opinion has already been stated, but I've been thinking about it a lot over the last day, and I must EXPRESS.)
Assuredly, "effortless perfection" (awesome phrase, btw) is a damaging concept - but I don't think it spawns from men. I think it's originally (primarily?)a marketing concept: "beauty," as it is defined by whatever product, is "natural" and "carefree." Think of "easy, breezy, beautiful CoverGirl" and "Nice N Easy" hair dye (man I love that, "adding this product to your beauty regimen will actually INCREASE the amount of free time in your life! Ingredients include aloe vera AND theoretical physics!") It's a bill of goods sold to both men and women, and BOTH buy it. Women are more likely than men to understand that it's a lie because we have actually put our time and money into achieving that "effortless" beauty, whereas men (typically) only perceive the end results. While (some) heterosexual men perpetuate this ideal, they didn't come up with it on their own. I don't think the XY chromosome includes a predisposition to inflict unrealistic standards upon women.
Laying so much of the blame on men bothers me because 1) I believe it's inaccurate and 2) one of the (unfair) charges leveled at feminism and feminists is that we are all a bunch of man haters and we want to blame men for all of the world's problems. I'm not an apologist for sexism, but I think it's important we remember it's behaviors and ideas (eg "effortless perfection") that harm women and not a group of people (eg "men" or even "most men.")
Ok, now that I got that out of my system - I really did enjoy the thought behind the essay. Great points and I love how much response it has generated.
Jrant,
if I could add a small detail a lot of us guys don't realize how much trouble that women go trough just to look naturally beautiful if we did we certainly try and understand more but we have always believed looking pretty was something that was part of being a women something they enjoyed doing like the hour long bubble bath or shopping but I guess we were misguided.
Mike,
It's hard to pigeonhole "all women" about the way they feel about this issue, just as it's hard to pigeonhole "all men" as endorsing the double standard. Some women DO like playing with hair and make up: it can make you feel attractive or it could be a means of creative expression, as an earlier poster said. But many women also feel if they don't pluck and dye and conceal and highlite and whatever, they aren't fit to be seen in public. THAT is unhealthy. eg A woman in her 20's may color her hair because it's "fun," but a 30+ woman with gray hairs may be convinced that her natural state (with gray hair) renders her an incredibly unattractive old hag. Coloring your hair isn't fun at that point: it's done out of panic and insecurity. Or think about make-up. It can be "fun" to put makeup on when going out with friends, but if it's early'o'clock and you "can't" go to work until you conceal that zit and hide the bags under your eyes and put color back into your cheeks...that's a completely different scenario.
But don't take my, or any posters', word as gospel. If there are women in your life, ASK THEM how they feel about this.
I never taught of it that way but your right if it becomes a series of unwanted tasks then the fun is not there anymore as for the women in my life I just keep looking at her as if she is perfect in every way.
I've heard the "never let him see you without makeup" advice from older women, but I think that's an artifact from a previous generation. I can't speak to the current generation of men, but mine was handed a sort of mixed bag. We were taught (by film, tv, etc.) to desire a woman who looks high maintenance, but can manage that look while camping in the High Sierras. It's not an impossible package, but it's pretty rare.
I once had a younger guy ask me for advice on how to write up his profile on a dating site. Basically, he was trying to figure out how to say, "No fat chicks" without being offensive. I told him that excluding women from his dating pool based on their size was unattractive and offensive because it was shallow, so he needed to not be shallow. If he figured out what he was really looking for in terms of deep structure, and not focus on the surface appearance, he'd be happier and get better results. And then we talked about that.
It turned out that he like athletic women because he had athletic hobbies and wanted someone to enjoy them with, so I recommended he focus on that, and not worry about body type nearly so much.
It's possible that I just taught him how to encode a prejudice in inoffensive language, but I hope he maybe learned something deeper.
My boyfriend wears makeup... sometimes more than me! He asks me to help him pick out foundation, cover-up, and eyeliner. I showed him how to put it on to make his skin tone even, and to pop out his eyes... but at the same time have it look like he's not wearing makeup.
Boys like to be pretty too, and I know they conform to societal pressures as well. (Why does steroid abuse exist?) Perhaps not as much as women in most cases, but it's still there.
I always tell my boyfriend he looks adorable with or without makeup. Personally, I have no preference about what he puts on his face, but I encourage him to do it because IT MAKES HIM FEEL GOOD ABOUT HIMSELF. It gives his confidence a real boost--which is why I wear makeup too. I like feeling sexy, and I like feeling pretty. That doesn't mean that I refuse to go out the door without makeup on, but on the days when I don't wear makeup, my mood is remarkably lowered... not because I feel ugly or anything (I still think I'm quite attractive without makeup) but I like to highlight the features I already appreciate to make myself feel even more beautiful.
The idea that women must wear make up to be socially accepted is extremely pervacive.
I had a rather intresting experance while I was deployed. I woke up and went use the bathroom trailer, during the time the the air force females that were living in the same building were getting ready to go to work. I found a half dozen women sitting in the sinks applying make-up. I cracked up laughing, but subsequent conversation revealed that this behavior was to attract males. This was August in a warzone and it was 120 something during the day and around 95 at night. Pretty much going outside guaranteed being soaked in sweat, but these women were putting make-up on to impress the males.
That is amazing! I would've thought, in that environment, keeping men off was the higher priority. Plus the male:female ratio hardly favors male choosiness.
This is a great post, so I hope it stays up for a while longer because a lot can be said about the topic. I wanted to add something that loosely relates to the topic. Idk if it's been said before on this thread because I'm not reading all 95 comments, but it has to do with this part:
"Most heterosexual men are consistent in their description of the kind of women they look for.They want a woman who's "real." Someone who's willing to be herself. They don't like it when women diet or worry about their weight. It's a turn-on when women can actually eat . And they'll all decry the superficiality of makeup, and express a preference for "natural" women."
Similarly het. men also say they don't care how a woman looks. "Seriously girls! Stop your fussing over your makeup and clothes! You're being way crazy!" Articles like these
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-499271/The-nearly-naked-truth-What-men-REALLY-think-strip-smalls.html
which are too numerous to count, make it seem like men are just lucky to even get to see us naked. And it's all because we're always holding out on them. They'll take anything really, it seems. Well I suppose I took that message a little too much to heart in high school. I'm attractive in the society-defined sense, yet whenever I asked someone out, they'd say no. Go figure! A guy usually likes to get to know a girl before he dates her? Weird! I guess I was being sexist myself in buying into the "men are sex-crazed animals" idea. Men won't "do" so long as you're attractive enough.
I've had to learn that to an extent too.
Still I wonder though, if you were attractive "ENOUGH" maybe they wouldn't need to get to know you first?
I've felt that maybe I'm cute enough to interest guys if they get to know me, but not so much that they're going to always take big risks by hooking up with me if they don't know me.
But yes, contrary to the insistance of older men and women, I've found that a lot of young men, especially intelligent ones, tend to be a bit shy and/or a bit discriminating.
"Still I wonder though, if you were attractive "ENOUGH" maybe they wouldn't need to get to know you first?
I've felt that maybe I'm cute enough to interest guys if they get to know me, but not so much that they're going to always take big risks by hooking up with me if they don't know me."
I have always felt this way. It takes effort and risk for men to brave possible rejection in approaching a woman. I always assumed that they gather up the courage to approach by riding a wave of desire that is greater than their instinctive fear at talking to a stranger and possibly being told "Eff off". If a woman can't inspire that kind of desire, she won't get hit on. Furthermore, it takes a lot of courage to make oneself vulnerable in order to have an intimate relationship. What with the way our culture trains men and boys to be invulnerable and distant, there is an incentive to remain aloof. The doors are pushed open and the walls come down when men are inspired by their desire and fascination. If a woman can't stir those, the land of Het Love is bound to be a lonely place.
If a dude is not into you, leave him alone and find another guy. If a guy approached you and you said "No thanks", it's just as understandable.
I've turned down many women in my time, even thought there was nothing really wrong with them.