"Shiny Suds" Shine No More
It appears that the folks at Method took the angry e-mails many of us wrote in response to <a href="http://www.feministing.com/archives/019035.html">
their creepy commercial</a> more seriously than their "I'm sorry you're offended" form letters suggested. The video is password-protected on Vimeo and has been removed from the main page of their "People Against Dirty" website!
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Ah, my HTML failed. If you missed the original post about the ad, you can read it here: http://www.feministing.com/archives/019035.html
Thankyou PaperisPatient!
I was so excited about this! I found a *new* reply in my inbox around 5:30 that did indeed take the whole protest more seriously. One snippet from the letter said this:
"Thank you for your sincere feedback about our “Shiny Suds” video. It was not at all our intent to offend or promote any form of harassment. We understand the concerns associated with our video and are removing it from YouTube and all other controlled sources."
It's always cool to see what a group effort can do. Thanks to PaperisPatient for posting the good news first!
Victory! Hurrah!
*sigh* I have to say, this is one of those instances that really frustrates me, because it's exactly the kind of pointless outrage that gives feminists a reputation for being overly aggressive and hypersensitive.
It was a bunch of cartoon soap bubbles acting like obnoxious construction workers which, not incidentally, is portrayed as a bad thing. And in response, dozens of people egged on by hyperbolic blog posts start a letter-writing campaign to get this horrible, awful, evil, triggering, rape-apologizing (seriously, wtf?) abomination of an ad pulled lest they start a boycott of the company's otherwise entirely worthwhile products.
So now, instead of a harmless little ad that caused precisely zero harm to the goals of feminism, we have yet another example of ridiculous overreaction for opponents to point to when we try to address legitimate issues of sexism and misogyny.
It was a commercial that tried to get its point across by featuring sexual harassment and verbal assault - yes, by some stupid cartoon bubbles. But when male voices are saying things like "Get in the tub, please." and "Come on, baby, you know you want it!" to a nude woman who is fearful and uncomfortable, that's absolutely worth getting angry about to me.
Exactly. It got its point across by depicting sexual harassment behavior as obnoxious and discomforting. It didn't make that behavior acceptable or excusable; quite the opposite in fact. And the behavior depicted, to be honest, didn't even come close to the level of egregiousness that so many of the comments on various feminist sites suggested. Calling it "verbal assault" or making references to "rape culture" are just rhetorical tricks designed to makes it sound far worse than it was. It was obnoxious sexual harasment. No one was assaulted in the commercial. No one was raped. And no allusions to such things were made. Nothing even close to that happened, and to pretend otherwise just ends up trivializing those issues when they actually do come up in other contexts.
No one was assaulted in the commercial. No one was raped. And no allusions to such things were made. ..to pretend otherwise just ends up trivializing those issues
How do you figure there were no allusions to sexual assault? Imagine if the woman were walking down the street alone and the bubbles were a group of real men. If a woman encountered a group of real men making sexual comments about "waiting" for her and "watching" her, she would feel threatened. She would be worried that a sexual assault was imminent. She would fear for her safety.
I think that the commercial itself trivializes sexual harassment and rape. I think rape and sexual violence is too serious of an issue to just be thrown around lightly (such as to advertise cleaning products).
How do you figure there were no allusions to sexual assault? Imagine if the woman were walking down the street alone and the bubbles were a group of real men.
Setting and context matter, though. Note, for instance, that your own analogy involves changing both to make the scene scarier and more threatening than it was. In my opinion, cartoon soap bubbles in a well-lit bathroom making lewd comments simply doesn't evoke the same thing as a lone woman being surrounded by a bunch of actual men in the street. The parallel just doesn't work, and that's why I think it's an example of hypersensitivity. Yes, you can draw the link, but it's tenuous and exaggerated at best.
I happened to watch the video for the first time with a friend who had been abused as a child and had a mildly similar experience to what was portrayed in the commercial. (I don't know the exact details, though I don't think it even matters.) What matters is my friend's reaction to the video, which was overwhelmingly negative. It's wonderful that they took the video down, but I don't think my friend will be buying method again even so, as the commercial was so triggering.
Your inability to imagine how commercials relate to real life astounds me.
Though I have sincere sympathy for your friend, beckeck06, I see that as an example of hypersensitivity. Perfectly legitimate and understandable given her personal experiences, of course, but those experiences and the level of sensitivity they've engendered make her a poor/biased judge of a commercial like this. I think the appropriateness of mass media should be judged by how it will impact the "average" person, not how it will impact the most sensitive among us.
"I think the appropriateness of mass media should be judged by how it will impact the "average" person, not how it will impact the most sensitive among us."
Do you really think sexual harassment and assault are so rare? I guess ignorance is bliss.
"One in three girls and one in five boys are sexually abused by an adult at some time during childhood."
My friend is hardly an aberration. You seem to think the fact that the commercial was taken down due to a lot of feminist noise has hurt the movement and survivors more than it has helped. I strongly disagree.
meant to cite that: http://www.baltimorecountymd.gov/Agencies/police/community/abuse.html
Thanks for the cite, beckeck06. I know this won't be a credibility-enhancing thing for me to say, but I'm very skeptical of the stats surrounding sexual abuse and sexual assault/rape. Virtually every time I've looked more closely at a study that purports to show such massive numbers, the methodology of the study is flawed. Also, even if the numbers for Baltimore are correct, Baltimore is not (thankfully) very representative of the nation as a whole. It's one of, if not the highest crime-rate cities in the country.
Anyway, that aside, even taking the frequently cited number of "1 in 4" women being sexually abused/raped in their lifetime, that means 75% of the female population has no such experience. As the number for men are even more favorable, we're talking about maybe 10-15% of the overall population having a sexually abusive experience, and only a portion of that group (for the sake of dicsussion, call it 50%) having lasting issues sufficient to make them sensitive to triggering. Do you really think mass media should be geared to the most sensitive 5-7% among us?
If so, what about other depictions of violence? Surely an even greater number of people would have experienced and thus have a heightened sensitivity to violence in general. How about car accidents? Huge numbers of people are severely injured or lose loved-ones in accidents every year. Should silly car chase/crash scenes be removed from all the TV shows and movies out there to avoid triggering memories of such horrific events? What about fires, heart attacks, etc.?
The point is, if the numbers for sex crimes are considered sufficient to put references thereto off limits, then many other things should be off limits too. I just don't think 90% of the country should be expected to cater that much to the 10% with a particular sensitivity.
Rape and sexual assault are underreported. 1 in 4 or 3 females in a group of females has been sexually assaulted. Thats pretty serious. I assure you it could be replicated in real life. Its not that small.
Does the "R" in RDAVE stand for "Rape-apologist"? Why are you so vested in convincing women, who are harassed and assaulted and beaten and raped in record numbers that we're too sensitive, that we're making something out of nothing, and that we need to get a sense of humor?
YOU don't think it's offensive, because what the hell do you care? You don't face this shit on a daily basis, so we shouldn't be offended either.
How's the air up there on Mt. Privilege, Dude?
"Setting and context matter, though."
Yes, it does - when she was being verbally abused in a sexual manner she was NAKED IN HER SHOWER. I think comparing it to walking down the street getting harassed is confusing what's triggering people here, and confusing you as to why it's offensive. Because she was naked in the shower it made the harassment more sexual in nature - if she had been clothed it would have been different; she was also in her own home in her own shower as opposed to out somewhere public, leading to thoughts of someone breaking in (something that worries all women, especially those living in areas with high levels of burglary and those who live on their own); this would then lead to unwelcome thoughts or recollections of sexual assault. A girl who lives a few roads away from mine had her house broken into and was raped - before they caught the guy do you think either of us would have wanted to stumble across this commercial? Because I know I was scared and this would have made it worse. Also being aware that commercials are mostly detrimental anyway (in fact the only people they generally benefit are the very few at the top who make most of the profit from scaremongering) I see no problem with saying "no, you shouldn't be showing this". However many PR and design companies get involved, and whatever special effects or camera angles they use, a commercial is NOT ART - IT'S THERE TO SELL YOU SOMETHING THAT YOU USUALLY DON'T NEED.
If I may say, you're serving as an example of exactly WHY this sort of thing is unacceptable.
Many women who have been victims of rape, sexual harassment and/or sexual assault were disturbed and upset by this advert. It bothered me because it was making a joke out of sexual harassment, trivialising something that I find extremely upsetting and dehumanising. As does your implication that 'obnoxious sexual harassment' is not something that women would be particularly hurt by and is not a part of rape culture.
I can only imagine that the reason you're failing spectacularly to understand this is due to a lack of empathy towards victims of harassment. Maybe if harassment was presented as less of a trivial matter in popular culture, you might be more likely to understand the distress and frustration of its victims, yes?
the further point that I think goes along with this is that-- not everyone who was disturbed by the commercial was necessarily a victim or even had a friend/victim in mind. Every time a woman is sexually assaulted this serves to make all women more afraid and feel unsafe.
to be honest, the part about the loofa is what really gets me-- because its funny. For a second I want to laugh. And that is where the real violence in this commercial is done. It makes assault FUNNY. I think the fact that we are all "hypersensitive" is a wonderful thing that feminism has done for us. It has made us wake to how awful and brainwashing repeated images of assault and violence against women are. No matter whether or not the commercial is capitalizing off of the negative value of assault in our culture, it is also appealing to our desire to SEE IMAGES OF WOMEN BEING ASSAULTED. There are other ways of rebuking this violence than to show it, and in effect feed it.
But comparing being sexually harassed to having some nasty scum left in your shower is totally inapt and really quite insulting to everyone who has been sexually harassed and found that experience affecting and upsetting.
I wouldn't call the ad harmless. It grossed me out something proper, as it did with many people, probably far more than those who bothered to comment. The fact that someone actually went through with making an ad like that pretty much points out the need for feminism, and just because it's something as minor as an ad doesn't mean it detracts from larger battles that need to be fought, too. We can address the small and large issues at the same time, because they're all part of the same complex, widespread issue.
A comment written written by msjessiemeghan on apartment therapy about this commercial really struck out at me:
"Because I was curious, I showed the commercial to 5 peers of each gender with no context. 100% of my male friends found the commercial to be funny, 100% of my female friends had the same reaction as I did. I found that to be fascinating. I attribute it to the fact that men have the privilege of not having to worry about sexual assault in there day-to-day lives where women on the other hand, mostly do, in our society. Non-scientific study of course :)"
So now, instead of a harmless little ad that caused precisely zero harm to the goals of feminism, we have yet another example of ridiculous overreaction for opponents to point to when we try to address legitimate issues of sexism and misogyny.
On the face of it this ad seems harmless, but I think what is important here is that the total sum effect of instances like this contribute to a skewed view of women and violence against women. Therein lies the problem, not to mention that fact that this ad was very inappropriate.
I would like to know what you consider to be legitimate issues of sexism? You mean cases of extreme sexism in legislation and human rights? Because I fight for both the big and small issues at the same time and it's never been an issue. :)
what makes me sad about when you comment is that people ever "like" it, and the lag time on someone writing counter-speech.
is there any way to communicate with bloggers outside of the posts? I don't want to derail anything but I'd be really interested in how you see yourself fitting in with feminism.
I think I understand where R.Dave is coming from because I felt the same way when I was younger. I could not understand why modern feminists concentrated so acutely on media misrepresentations of women. I felt it quite inconsequential I suppose, after all, yes a lot of things bugged me but I never let it get me down or affect my life (yes I know, quite naive to think this way). I always felt this low level of sexism in the background, but chose to ignore it. Women are being sold and murdered on the other side of the world just because they were born into the wrong gender, I thought.
Well, no shit. But sexism in media, compounded every single day, can and does have disastrous consequences. Not only that, but most feminists in the west concentrate on western issues because that is what they have the most experience in. I appreciate it's difficult to fully dedicate yourself to fighting the battle of an issue associated with a culture so different from your own.
I'm going off on a slight tangent now, but my point is I think I know where R.Dave is coming from. Correct me if I'm wrong...
FAQ: Why are you concentrating on X when Y is so much more important?
http://www.re-nest.com/re-nest/news/methods-shiny-suds-spoof-commercial-102449
I dont think we were the only ones. I havent watched the video since it was taken down before I could see it but others seem to have found it offensive as well.
Also the reason why people depict feminists as people who cant take jokes is to dismiss feminist argument not because they have a point. Ive heard that said about rape jokes too.
As a feminist with a sense of humor who markets green cleaning products (Method is a competitor) I really enjoyed this discussion! Keep it coming for the sexist ads! I've felt like a lone voice.
My satire that came out last week, STRESSED in SCOTTSDALE, features a Women Studies prof who gets involved in a Green party campaign. There is humore out there...
Marcia Fine
www.marciafine.com
lol! I'm sure you'll do better as long as you stay away from the sell cleaning products/messages by using the suggestion of sexual assault meme! Obviously method didnt.
yea, good thing it has been removed. it's still all over youtube though...which sucks because anything and everything is a go on youtube.
I just watched it after this heads up... and yeah, its pretty sick. Definitely reminds you of sexual assault. I wanted to punch one of the suds in the face.
If only there was some way that we could censor youtube ..
I hesitate to call censorship the answer, even for something like this. The only thing I can see to do is to comment on the videos posted and express our opinions in the hopes that it will make a few people see the problematic aspects of the ad.
Good idea. I just checked on the video, and it turns out that nearly every comment is positive about the advert.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dr9cE0lLrFg
There are even comments like "I genuinely do feel? bad for those who were terrified by cartoon bubbles. For them, life must be extremely difficult, and the world must be filled with horrible messages."
Hmm, I really don't know what to do. If only we could censor people's opinions.