This is certainly interesting. A woman who planned an abortion but had a miscarriage instead tweeted the following:
"I'm in a board meeting. Having a miscarriage. Thank goodness, because there's a f*****-up 3-week hoop-jump to have an abortion in Wisconsin."
She is being widely criticised for it, being called "a poor excuse for a human being" by some commenters because "other women are devastated by miscarriage" and she's apparently being selfish by being relieved and using twitter to announce it.
However, the woman, Penelope Trunk, says she has no regrets. She has suffered two miscarriages before and describes them as "inconsolable. The difference was I desperately wanted that baby... it seems like everyone in the world would prefer miscarriage to an abortion, even the pope."
I think this last comment is very illuminating. The miscarriage would have happened whether she wanted the baby or not. But the fact that she didn't want it is apparently what makes her a bad person and a selfish woman. The idea of a pregnant woman not wanting the child she would give birth to, or even one that she has given birth to already, is something much more widespread than people like to admit, and it makes people uncomfortable to think of it. But I am with this poster who said: "You are shining a light into areas which many share but go unexposed."
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The Good: She got a free, natural abortion that she WANTED.
The Bad: It occured during a friggin board meeting.
The Ugly: She tweeted this very personal information to lots of people, some of whom may have been having a miscarriage themselves and find no relief in the loss of their wanted but dying fetus.
I can completely understan dwhy she'd be happy about not having to have an abortion. It's unreasonable to be HAPPY about needing to have an abortion in the first place (the goal is to not be pregnant in teh first place or have a healthy wanted pregnancy right?) so it makes sense that in leiu of an abortion she miscarried.
HOWEVER.
To express this joy to a large audience of people can be problematic. Just as it would be cruel for a cis woman to tweet "Thank goodness I was born with a vagina, do you know how much it costs to buy one these days?!" Many pre-op trans women would be upset NOT because she was cis but because its like throwing it in their face. I have no doubts a lot of the anger is coming from women who have miscarried wanted babies themselves or even women who didnt miscarry and HAD to abort instead who feels as though her situation was thrown in their faces.
Phenicks: I don't agree with your last point. It was her twitter page and no one else's business, how she should feel. Sure - they can comment on her announcement if they wish but it is still her right to say that.
I believe it is more just about woman-hating, personally. It's that she is GLAD about the miscarriage that people are angry about. It's the same as the old anti-abortion rubbish about baby-killing rather than a woman's right to her body.
It's this that people are upset about. That although the miscarriage was unintentional...that she was HAPPY that it happened and that she was going to have an abortion anyway.
I am sure some commentors have been personally affected by miscarriage....but she didn't say that they were wrong to mourn theirs. All she said was that she was happy about hers. And on her own twitter page, she has that right.
No doubt, her page- her way. However jsut as SHE has freedom of speech, so do her follwoers and it isn't a private venue, she has over 20,000 followers. I'd hardly call that private.
There is NOTHING a person can do to force a miscarriage. Either you have an intentional abortion OR you have an unintentional miscarriage. Both are the same thing the only difference is one is not a choice.
It would be like a person who intends to be childless finding out they are sterile and saying how WONDERFUL it is to be sterile to a mixed group of people, some of whom may be sterile. While it is wonderful for YOU it still is insensitive to say that in the company of those who just don't feel the same way.
I stand by her right to tweet this (especially since it's been pissing off anti-choicers!) I also like that she flies in the face of those (on both the right and the left) who insist that all women must be maternal and nurturing and yearning for babies.
And if it offends anyone on her twitter feed, well, they have an "unfollow" option on that site. Are the people who are up in arms actual followers of hers or just people who've heard it elsewhere? (I first heard this news story some time ago, actually, on a childfree website.)
"She tweeted this very personal information to lots of people, some of whom may have been having a miscarriage themselves and find no relief in the loss of their wanted but dying fetus."
By that logic women who are happy about their pregnancies should keep quiet about it in case someone reading/listening is pregnant, unable to get an abortion, and find no relief in their persistent gravidity.
Yes, exactly.
You make a point but you gloss over something, MOST women who miscarry and KNOW they are miscarrying are not people who planned on having abortions anyway. If that were the case (I think it would WONDERFUL if everyone who wanted an aborton just miscarried doesn't get any more free or accessible than that)abortion clinics would be losing boatloads of money to nature.
Because what occured is HIGHLY uncommon and her reaction was equally uncommon I think it lacked sensitivity. Everyone has a right to be insensitive, being a jerk isn't illegal either doesn't mean you SHOULD do it or that you have some moral highground to stand on when you do and others are offended or don't like it.
I thin when you start belittling abortion for the masses because a few are lucky to get natural abortions then you're being insensitive.
Its true that reading that might have been painful for some people, might have reminded them of bad memories. Does that mean she shouldn't have said it? In my opinion, no, it doesn't. She can say what she wants on her twitter feed. Yes its public, but its not the same as going up to a specific friend who hasn't been able to concieve and saying "nananana i had a miscarriage."
This attitude makes sense though, on this blog. I'm always surprised at the lengths that people want to go to here to avoid even potentially reminding someone they've never met about something that might possibly upset them (see the thread about allies asking questions if you don't know what I'm talking about). If that is how you always censor your conversations, then clearly you should never mention anything like having a miscarriage or getting pregnant or getting divorced or anything like that that might remind someone else of their own bad experiences.
But I don't think its reasonable to expect everyone in the world to follow those standards (outside of a designated safe-space therapy group). She has every right to be happy about her miscarriage and to say so. People can unfollow her on twitter if they want, but they can't expect everyone on twitter to preemptively avoid anything that might potentially upset them.
I also am not convinced her reaction is so "HIGHGLY" uncommon. It is probably less than 50%, but I don't think its all that unusual. Its more likely that we think it is more uncommon because people are afraid of admitting/expressing it.
The difference between telling my friend I'm pregnant if she miscarried or that I miscarried too if she miscarried is that chnces are, she would feel slighted if I *didnt* tell her. As friends she trusted me with personal information about herself and if I cant give her much in return its to trust her with my feelings and intimate details of my life. The way in which I'd make such announcements would bear in mind how she feels and the way she accepts the information would bear in mind how *I* possibly feel.
If I don't know you AT ALL and I say, "why gosh , im sitting here in my board meeting and just got word that my mom just died, now I don't have to pull her feeding tube YAY!!!" YOU could be in the same situation and feeling differently and wondering WTF did I tell you that. What purpose does it serve to tell you that other than to celebrate something MOST people find upsetting? It does NOT invalidate how YOU feel but it was insensitive of me to say it to a stranger and expect them to share in my happiness or go "congrats!"
I think that if you said that you were relieved your mother had died because it ended her suffering, a lot of people would understand that feeling. Some people would be offended, of course, but that wouldn't mean you were wrong.
In any case, it is a legitimate point of view that an embryo is not a person to be mourned (like an elderly parent would be). An embryo has less consciousness than a mouse or a lizard. If you don't agree with that that's fine, but you won't have much luck trying to force other people to police their thoughts and words to match your views.
I think its really too bad that most people view an abortion as something that shouldn't be admitted to or discussed in public. Being relieved at having a miscarriage because you were going to have an abortion is the same thing. People are mad because she said she didn't want the baby and would have had an abortion. I bet that if she said "I would have continued the pregnancy and given the child up for adoption, but I'm relieved that god had other plans" people wouldn't be nearly as upset. She is expressing that she didn't want to be pregnant, she would have ended it, and she's happy nature ended it for her. Its absolutely her right to make the choice to end her pregnancy, and I don't think its a shameful choice that she should feel guilty about. The more women admit to their decision to end a pregnancy, and the more women who admit that they don't feel guilty at ending a very early pregnancy, the less stigmatized it will be. I view that as a good thing. If you don't, that's too bad, but luckily its not your decision what this woman thinks or says or does with/about her own body.
Ah.
You see your argument on consciousness gets to the specifics of my point. I said pull her feeding tube which in most cases imply a state of unconsciousness where her life depends on machines like the life of the unborn depends on someone's body.
My exact quote said NOTHING about being relieved at her not suffering but at my not having to pull the plug. Maybe the joy was in guilt free demise of her. I'm free to feel that way. Is it insensitive yes, is it my right to express that insensitivity of course.
That's my point. A miscarriage is often a sad experience just as the death of a dying parent. Even when that parent was better off dead than suffering its just better not to celebrate their death publicly in mixed crowds. Just as the fetus was going to be aborted either way (naturally or intentionall)- it was just better not to make a public spectacle of her celebration. Her right? YES.
Okay, so if we assume that most women who have miscarriages don't want to and are sad about it, then should women who have successful pregnancies avoid announcing it in case a woman who has had a miscarriage is offended?
My sister had a miscarriage and every time she hears about a woman having a healthy baby, she feels deeply sad. But of course it's ridiculous to suggest that women shouldn't "flaunt" their ability to carry a fetus to term.
Good for her.
While part of me will never quite understand fully what motivates some people to 'twitter' every event of their lives (especially the most private parts)she has a right to say how she feels about this and I'm glad she doesn't feel guilty. In fact, I'm almost relieved she was able to get some self-righteous panties in a wad over her refusal to feel guilty about nature ending a pregnancy that she didn't want because it saved her the inconvenience, expense, and physical energy to have it ended on her own. So good for her.
I'm sick of people who feel that just because something is a personal tragedy for them that it should affect everyone else the same way. That is so unenlightened and self-obsessed. People like me who are childless by choice/childfree are no strangers to hearing how awful it is that we don't want babies when there are women struggling with heartbreaking infertility. What does my choice have to do with any of that? If I had 10 kids it still wouldn't change the fact that someone else can't have any, and it wouldn't suck any less for them, either. Would her not having a miscarriage (AKA, 'God's abortion') have changed anything for anyone else? No. It isn't her fault that some other posters may have a sad experience with miscarriage, and she is still entitled to label HER experience as she sees fit.
Women are assumed to be automatically maternal and obsessed with childbirth by default. In my own life, my mother's mother was not at all inclined in that direction and I have had female friends who don't feel the compulsion to coo at the nearest baby or small child.
In a society where we are already dangerously inclined to navel-gaze, I'm not sure I would have Tweeted something this personal, I am sorry for the criticism she has received as a result of it.
You know, good for her. I think that I wouldn't post something like that publicly precisely because I'd be afraid of the reaction from other people-- Twitter is so public, there's for sure going to be someone who is offended. But I don't honestly think there's anything wrong with her reaction to having a miscarriage. If she didn't want the baby and was going to have an abortion anyway, a miscarriage would be a huge relief and there's no reason she should have to lie about that.
Pissing off people who don't believe in female bodily autonomy: Finally a reason to use Twitter!
I would have imagined that even those against abortion would have been able to realize that her reaction is natural for her situation and that she should not be criticized for being relieved by the miscarriage. The media's reaction vilification is inappropriate.
In my opinion at least, the lack of discretion in her post does not concern her honest admission of relief, but is tied to the trend in society to proclaim one's private thoughts and actions in such a public forum as Twitter.
That being said, even though I understand from her website that she's the CEO of her own company, I'm suprised she couldn't wait to post to Twitter until after the board meeting.
Yeah, a whole separate thing is whether her company will be annoyed that she was twittering during a board meeting. I'd also be concerned in general about having a public twitter feed about very personal things with my real name attached. It seems risky in some vague way. But if you are going to participate in the whole twitter thing where you twitter every little thing, then her post is totally fine.
A miscarriage in itself is not something to celebrate. The circumstances of this particular woman means that it is a good thing for her - she's pleased and relieved and I'm glad. But I don't think this is about female autonomy or woman hating.
Yeah, a lot of this is based on sensibilities - "that's not a sentiment I approve of so you shouldn't have it!" - but autonomy is a tricky concept here. This woman has the autonomy to decide her reaction to her miscarriage but miscarriage itself is the ultimate expression of a woman being subject to her own biology.
It's the difference between not getting pregnant because you've successfully used contraception and not getting pregnant because you're not physically able to. Regardless of whether you want to be pregnant or not, one is an excercise of bodily autonomy, the other is a biological fact that one is subject to.
You choose an abortion, a miscarriage happens to you. I think it's feminist to support this women's choice to express her emotions honestly, but it seems profoundly wrong to me for feminists to act as though a miscarriage is an 'eazy breezy' alternative to abortion if you don't want to be pregnant. Miscarriages are not safe. They are not painless. There will not necessarily be anyone there to support you or hold your hand.
For me this isn't about women who want to be pregnant miscarrying, it's about denying the profound affect a miscarriage can have on any woman, regardless. I miscarried when I was planning to have an abortion and - although I was relieved - it was far more traumatic than having a safe, supported abortion. A friend congratulated me when I told her, as if this had solved my problem rather than being an unnecessarily upsetting experience in itself.
I think I'm reacting to this from a place of intense personal experience. Please read this as horribly biased. I'm not attacking this woman - I support her choice and I'm glad that she's glad. But I worry sometimes that we trivialise miscarriage (as feminists). Abortion is one thing - safe, legal, no need to explain - but miscarriage is something entirely different.
God. These comments have been really triggering. I'm gonna post this anyway - I'm sorry for rambling.
True, a miscarriage happens out of your control, and can potentially be an indicator of other health problems, or have bad side effects. But I still think her feelings on the subject are reasonable in her case-- it sounds like she's not experiencing any other health issues along with it, and she's just happy at her luck that this out of control thing just happened to be what she wanted. Similarly, being sterile (naturally, not through surgery or anything) is something that is not under your control, its your body taking over your decisions, etc etc, and it can be an indicator of other health problems. But still, someone who really doesn't want kids might be happy to find out they are sterile (with no other health problems along with it) because it means they don't have to bother anymore with birth control or surgery to become sterile. It doesn't mean they're implying that anyone else should be happy at being sterile, but in their case, its exactly what they wanted.
I'm sorry if these comments have been upsetting for you. I never know when people say "these comments are triggering" if they are implying that people shouldn't have posted those comments. Your post makes a good point that miscarriages aren't always trivial even if you didn't want a baby. However, I think in her case its clear that she is otherwise healthy and that her miscarriage isn't going especially badly, or she wouldn't be in a board meeting. I don't think anyone is saying a miscarriage is always a better option than an abortion, just that if it does happen to be what you wanted, its ok for you to say so.
"It's the difference between not getting pregnant because you've successfully used contraception and not getting pregnant because you're not physically able to. Regardless of whether you want to be pregnant or not, one is an excercise of bodily autonomy, the other is a biological fact that one is subject to."
Exactly, no one is questioning her bodily autonomy here but nature. Nature took away her right to choose and fored an abortion on her. Had she changed her mind it would have been too late, nature decided she wasn't having this baby, not her. And she's celebrating that, which is fine for her to celebrate for herself but she made it a PUBLIC celebration and once you make somethign that is otherwise private, a public matter you open it up to scrutiny and criticism, as she did.
Aside from the idea that she's being insensitive towards people who had unwanted miscarriages, this seems a little bit like when mothers dare to voice unhappiness at any part of motherhood, they get jumped all over for being unmotherly. One example I'll always remember is reading a blog where a mom expressed relief at having a break from her toddler's desire to be touching her all the time when the toddler went to stay with grandma for the weekend, and people treated her like a monster in the comments for daring to dislike her kid always wanting to be attached to her.
She has the right to say whatever she wants -- and people have the right to think she's an obnoxious jerk. When she says such things in a public (or semi-public) forum, she should probably expect some people to recoil.
For anti-choice people who consider a fetus to be an individual deserving of all the appreciation of a born child -- I can certainly see how expressing relief at a deceased fetus would be offensive. To such people, it would come off as similar to expressing relief that your 1-month old infant died in her crib because you avoided 18-years of hassle. It would come off as dancing on a grave. I believe their opinion is skewed -- but, given the premise from which they begin, their offense at her statement is understandable.
However, it is probably not only the anti-choice that are offended here. People have abortions, but even pro-choice people see the act of aborting as necessary, but hardly desirable. Coming out of an abortion clicking your heels would seem somewhat insensitive -- and so does this.
It also comes off as somewhat insensitive to people who have endured miscarriages that they did not welcome. A miscarriage is rarely a blessing, and is often a traumatizing event. That it was not traumatizing for her is a good thing ... but some sensitivity here would not be uncalled for.
I think she was perfectly within her rights in expressing her feelings -- whether she was insensitive or lacking in decorum is another matter. I am constantly baffled at the extremely personal information people will post on social networking sites.
kbz